Art Monk not in the HOF - DUMP SI

[carolinakat]

This is BS


Monk was the Man

[Countertrey]

DUMP SI!

Can't... dumped them years ago.

But, I would if I could!

[NC43Hog]

Dumped SI around 1980. Obviously I was ahead of the curve!

[Cooley47]

I am dumping SI as we speak

Peter King is a moron and they're other writers don't respect the Skins either it is ridiculous

The fact that Art Monk is not in the hall of fame is so stupid.....it makes me disappointed in the entire NFL

[NC43Hog]

I am dumping SI as we speak

Peter King is a moron and they're other writers don't respect the Skins either it is ridiculous

The fact that Art Monk is not in the hall of fame is so stupid.....it makes me disappointed in the entire NFL

When you guys dump SI, you need to let them know why - much more effective that way, write a letter - be professional tho!

[tcwest10]

Are you sure that, by dumping your subscription to the magazine King and Zimmerman work for, you'll change their vote for next year ?
Are you sure that Monk would want to get in the Hall because some editor twisted the arm of some columnist to change his vote ?
There has to be a better way.
Maybe what we should do is have somebody draft a letter (I volunteer) to the editor to appear in the print edition. We'll sign all our names. If we choose to unsubscribe, that's fine.
Let's be more organized about this. One voice.
C'mon, now.
All this anger comes up this time every year. By March, I'm the only one still whining about it. (No, GF, that doesn't make me a better fan...just a guy who holds a grudge longer.)
It can be done.
Let's just do it in a more orderly fashion.
Here's a copy of an email I just sent to Woody Paige, a Monk supporter.
Mr. Paige,
I know that you're probably all worn out from what has been a hectic weekend for a man in your profession. I don't ask for an immediate response. I have plenty of time.
My name is Todd Westerfield, and I am a fan of the Washington Redskins. Art Monk was my boyhood hero.
I know from your response to my previous email that you are in support of his induction.
What can I, one man with no vote, do to help this cause ?
It breaks my heart to see him come so close yet again, but not cross the "finish line", so to speak.
Please, Woody. After you've had a chance to relax, please consider my question and reply.
Todd Westerfield

[carolinakat]

Dear board members,

As you may be aware, Art Monk was not only not inducted in the HOF but he was not even selected among the finalists to be voted for the 80% majority earlier today.

I sincerely believe that this was due to the active lobby of several lousy Sports Illustrated writers such as Paul Zimmerman and Peter King. Their conduct is disgraceful and shameful. I believe that the fans also have a right to make themselves heard by these types in the only way they undertand:

DUMP your subscriptions to Sports Illustrated if you have any, and encourage as many other fans as you can to dump them too.

Let us start a campaign to DUMP SI

I dumped them a long time ago

[Redskin in Canada]

Are you sure that, by dumping your subscription to the magazine King and Zimmerman work for, you'll change their vote for next year ?

In fact, I am sure of the opposite. I am convinced that these two people will NEVER change their vote against Art Monk. They have invested a lot of energy and pride voting against Art. It is too late to change some people.

Acquiescence in law, history and society is a deadly weapon. Different people have different ways to act under adversity. I do not propose that this action be the only action taken to help Art. I do not even argue that this is the BEST action to support Art.

I am saying that this is an action that can be heard loud and clear by them and by others. Journalists have an OBLIGATION to be respoonsible for their opinions. They must be fair. These two individuals are anything but fair.

Are you sure that Monk would want to get in the Hall because some editor twisted the arm of some columnist to change his vote ?

I know Art is a guy with so much class that he might be quite willing to just step back and walk away from this garbage.

I do not believe that one action can or must be taken INSTEAD of another. I support your efforts to write to people and all. But I will keep on holding Paul Z. and Peter K. together with their SI magazine responsible for their lousy behaviour.

DUMP SI!

[tcwest10]

I wrote to Woody Paige and Charles Chandler, who I know to be staunch supporters of #81.
I got this reply back from Chandler today.


Hi Todd,

Thanks for your e-mail, and for your courtesy.

There are some dissenters on the committee in regard to whether Monk was "great" or "just very good." If you come up with a new angle to refute that"just very good" argument, let me know. Other than that I'd say if you're a praying man, then to pray for justice -- for the right thing to be done regarding Monk.

Sincerely,

Charles Chandler
The Charlotte Observer

I am not a praying man, but I am sure that Monk was, in his time, "great".
I'll leave the praying to those who believe in that sort of thing.

[Redskin in Canada]

... If you come up with a new angle to refute that "just very good" argument, let me know. ...

Sincerely,

Charles Chandler
The Charlotte Observer

Here it goes, as a way of a comparison with four other WRs -already- inducted in the Hall of Fame:

Angle 1:

Regular Season

Player___________Career__Receptions_____Yards_____TD's

James Loften_____1978-93_____764________14,004_____75
Steve Largent____1976-89_____813________13,089____100
Art Monk________1980-94_____940________12,721_____68
John Stallworth___1974-87_____537_________8,723_____63
Lynn Swann______1974-82_____336_________5,462_____51

Angle 2:

Playoffs

Player________Games___Receptions___Yds___TD's___SB Rings

James Loften____12________41_______749_____8_____0
Steve Largent____7________23_______434_____4_____0
Art Monk________15________69_____1,062_____7_____3
Lynn Swann_____13________43_______830_____8_____3
John Stallworth___15________52_____1,014____12_____3

Angle 3:

Super Bowls

Player________Games_Receptions_Yds__TD's__SB Rings

James Loften____2_______8_____153____0____0
Steve Largent___0_______0_______0____0____0
Art Monk________3_______9_____179____0____3
Lynn Swann_____3______16_____364____3____3
John Stallworth___3_______8_____244____3____3

How are the above statistics from three angles for a demonstration of inconsistent and unfair behaviour by the voters towards Art Monk?

[redskincity]

You guys need to face it, Art will not make it to the HOF.

If he makes it, its because Peter King aor Dr.Z decided to step down.

[Redskin in Canada]

You guys need to face it, Art will not make it to the HOF.

If he makes it, its because Peter King aor Dr.Z decided to step down.

Art Monk WILL make it to the HOF. And I am going to enjoy his classy speech when he makes it.

As far as the two idiots mentioned in your message, they can go to hell for all I care. They must be ridiculed every step they take, every appearance they make, every time they show up somewhere.

DUMP SI!!!

[redskincity]

I'm with ya. He will.

[brandies]

I think it is time to dump the hall of fame and have the "Peoples hall of fame" These individuals wouldn't but Hank Aaron in the hall of fame because he never hit 50 hrs in a season.

[Redskin in Canada]

I think it is time to dump the hall of fame and have the "Peoples hall of fame" These individuals wouldn't but Hank Aaron in the hall of fame because he never hit 50 hrs in a season.

Welcome to the best Skins website in the net. You are already a good member in my book.

[tcwest10]

RiC, I think you could approach this in a more constructive manner. Did you notice the new petition in "Around The League" ? That's one way of doing it.
Dumping your SI subscription ? How does that change anything ? What about the Swimsuit issue ? Every year, thousands drop their subscriptions due to some misplaced outrage over the scantily-clad models.
It just doesn't work. The machine is too big for that.
There has to be a better way.

[Redskin in Canada]

RiC, I think you could approach this in a more constructive manner. Did you notice the new petition in "Around The League" ? That's one way of doing it.

I do not oppose other approaches. If you feel that is the way it works best, fine. The petition approach has been tried before and we should pursue that option as well.

However, I personally do not believe that Paul Z. or Peter K. will EVER change their vote. It is hopeless to try to reason with them. Your approach assumes that these are sensible, reasonable and fair individuals. They are not.

Their pride and prejudice (with an apology to Jane Austen) against Art Monk can not be reversed in a rational manner. Your petition approach assumes that they can be persuaded beyond their prejudices. They can not.

No, my approach is that they need to be ridiculed because their conduct is ridiculous. They need to know that if they hate a player without reason, fans will hate them back with good reason. They need to know that if they want to punish Art Monk, the fans will punish them back in anyway we can.

No, TC, I do not believe that a rational, civil, and kind "meeting of minds" is an effective approach to deal with these two types.

You are right, the machine is big, waaaay big and powerful. But our cause is a just and fair cause. Our side has something their side for all their money and power does not have: THE TRUTH.

Art Monk deeserves to be inducted in the Hall of Fame.

Some might think that standing on the side of a fair and just cause with the underdog against a big and powerful orgainisation is crazy. It is. But I would not have it any other way in this case.

[Redskin in Canada]

What about the Swimsuit issue ? Every year, thousands drop their subscriptions due to some misplaced outrage over the scantily-clad models.

And yes, in the absence of good sports reporting, they have to resort to chauvinistic behaviour and soft porn to make SI attractive to some readers. All the more justification to dump SI!

If they want to be a true sports magazine they could start by recruiting good writers and publishing intelligent articles.

[JansenFan]

Yeah, how about Hog Wire Magazine - Powered by theHogs.net!

[skinsfan1]

Yeah, how about Hog Wire Magazine - Powered by theHogs.net!

Sounds Good, I would subscribe. Maybe a way to make money for the site.....

[tcwest10]

Well, clicking on the PayPal icon is a good way to make money for the site, too.
Anyway, RiC (see how I'm responding to different posters in one reply ? ), firstly... it's not my petition. It was started by DCF. Secondly, it's not about changing the vote. It's about making public which selectors voted for whom. You could then ask the individual selectors about "why" or "how", if you wanted.
Oh, and pardon me...but I'm a massive fan of the swimsuit issue. I have a nice collection of them.
Nobody wants to see Monk in more than I do, but I don't see this as a way to do it.

[Redskin in Canada]

firstly... it's not my petition. It was started by DCF.

True. But it is an approach that you support. I believe that it is not useless. But it is hopeless against people that have power and do not wish to diminish it or even be accountable for it.

Secondly, it's not about changing the vote. It's about making public which selectors voted for whom. You could then ask the individual selectors about "why" or "how", if you wanted.

Good luck. Since when did the powerful give away control willingly?

It is a private club. No... more like a maffia. Why would they bother telling us necessarily who exactly voted for whom and why?

But most importantly, the two people that are mainly responsible for the campaign against Art Monk have told us so in their articles. What else do you need to know?

So, there you have them. Do you really think that you can persuade them? Do you feel that Peter K. and Paul Z. even want to hear from fans like you and I?

Oh, and pardon me...but I'm a massive fan of the swimsuit issue. I have a nice collection of them.

Sex sells and they got you. I personally believe very strongly in both freedom of expression and the respect for women's dignity. I do not impose my morality on anybody. I just feel that it is a cheap trick to lure male readers through the use of soft porn.

Nobody wants to see Monk in more than I do, but I don't see this as a way to do it.

We may agree on the first part and disagree on the second. But I sincerely respect your opinions and admire your tenacity and dedication to fight in favour of this noble cause.

[Redskin in Canada]

Why do you consider me "immoral" for having the swimsuit issue ?

No, I have not passed any moral or ethical judgment on anybody at all. On the contrary, I believe very strongly in freedom of expression.

The point in the post is that sex sells. It is a well known tactic in marketing and advertisement. The purpose of the SI swimsuit issue is to lure males into subscribers. It is a sexist sales trick.

The swimsuit issue does not have ANY relationship with any sports. It is not a celebration of the beauty of women as intelligent human beings. It does not have any purpose other than to treat women as advertising sexual objects.

Some people may consider it degrading to women. I simply consider it ridiculous and most of all fake. It is a blunt marketing trick: the acquisition of a soft porn magazine disguised as a "bonus" issue to lure male subscribers. They have a target market.

I simply choose not to be one of their "targets". The price to pay is too high: I would have to contribute to the monthly income of people like Peter K. and Paul Z.

[BringThePain!]

So you wouldn't support anybody who has one of these either..... right?



I don't recall these being the outfits the cheerleaders use to wear in high school... :-"



I mean the cheerleaders aren't really there to "lead us in cheer".... cause it's kinda hard to here them in the upper deck, or even 10 rows off the field for that matter....

[Redskin in Canada]

So you wouldn't support anybody who has one of these either..... right?

I do not support anybody because they own or do not own a swimsuit calendar. If that is the kind of thing they are in the market for, fine. It is their choice.

I don't recall these being the outfits the cheerleaders use to wear in high school... :-"

Indeed, some people buy these calendars because this is as close as they will get to an attractive woman without feeling threatened by rejection.

I mean the cheerleaders aren't really there to "lead us in cheer".... cause it's kinda hard to here them in the upper deck, or even 10 rows off the field for that matter....

If the swimsuit calendar is the reason why some people are Redskins fans and they purchase it, fine. They may not be the most knowledgeable or strong fans but it is their choice. I am not a fan of the Skins for that reason nor does Danny get any of my money for the calendar.

And there is a VERY substantial difference between our Cheerleaders and the SI issue. Our girls do a ton of charity presentations and social work. But essentially the calendar is a commercial operation in exchange for a sexual fantasy.