No Luck... so... Now What?

[Kilmer72]

I like it - we get R Griffin III (or Landry Jones) - he becomes a great QB and leader for 10-12 years or more

Mike finally tells Kyle to adjust what he does to suit the players he has, NOT what he thinks will work offensively

it's a win/win

nah... its wong wong, as Elmer Fudd might say... Kyle ain't adapting. OTOH... Griffin can very quickly learn a significant portion of Kyle's style, in the same way that they were using Beck... you will recall, that, with Beck in the game, Kyle took advantage of his mobility to help out the O-line, via the boot leg, moving him out of the pocket, and helping to extend plays that way. This is something that is immediately available to a player like RGIII...

This is part of Kyles scheme that is not used very much with Grossman... in other words, Kyle does have scheme components that will take advantage of an athletic quarterback's skills... I don't see Kyle as being an obstruction to Griffins growth here.

now ... can we figure out how to CONSISTENTLY get more pressure on the QB WITHOUT blitzing?
that will make the secondary look like one of the best in the NFL

There is a DE currently on IR who is a big piece of the answer here... He will act as a multiplier for both Kerrigan and Orakpo, because he will demand attention.

Yes sir..Right on Countertrey. That is what I hope happens. What would really make me laugh is if we did draft Griff and he happened to be better than Luck. I heard a rumor from someone at work that Mike Shan isn't too high on Griff though. I am not sure what he doesn't like about him. So, if Barkley isn't available that would only leave Jones as the next best right? I am still hoping for Griff.

[StorminMormon86]

Of all the prospects coming up, I'd definitely like to see us nab RG3. I like his athleticism, his attitude, and obviously his ability at the QB position. But I doubt the Shanahans will draft him. He's not necessarily the type of QB that I see to "fit" into Kyle's scheme. It'll be a similar situation where the Shanahans try to force a QB to adapt to their way and I definitely don't think that's the right thing to do when you're trying to groom the future.

[1niksder]

Matt Kalil, USC's starting left tackle, and projected top 5 pick is reportedly staying at USC for his senior year. I don't know if this will sway Barkley, but if both of them go back USC has a pretty good chance at the national championship since there bowl ban is over after this season. Would be a pretty big blow to the qb draft class if Barkley stays at USC.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/976243-matt-kalil-staying-at-usc-will-this-convince-matt-barkley-to-stay-as-well

One of the major early questions about the upcoming draft has been answered.

ESPN’s Chris Mortensen reports that USC tackle Matt Kalil has decided to go pro. Mort believes Kalil is a top-five pick, potentially the premier left tackle in this draft. Matt’s brother Ryan plays for the Panthers and is the highest paid center in football.

We still haven’t heard about USC quarterback Matt Barkley’s status yet. It was believed that whether Kalil stayed would be a bellwether for Barkley’s future. We’d expect Barkley to declare his status sooner than later.

PFT

[1niksder]

Updated draft order


Indianapolis (0-13)
Minnesota (2-11)
St. Louis (2-11)
Washington (4-9)
Jacksonville (4-9)
Carolina (4-9)
Miami (4-9)
Cleveland (4-9)
Tampa Bay (4-9)
Philadelphia (5-8)
Buffalo (5-8)
Kansas City (5-8)
Arizona (6-7)
Seattle (6-7)
San Diego (6-7)
Dallas (7-6)
Tennessee (7-6)
Cincinnati (7-6)
Chicago (7-6)
Cincinnati - from Oakland (7-6)

This is prior to the Jags getting blown-out tonight

[StorminMormon86]

I also keep forgetting about the possibility of the Rams drafting a QB and wanting to trade away Bradford. I wouldn't mind getting him.

[The Hogster]

I also keep forgetting about the possibility of the Rams drafting a QB and wanting to trade away Bradford. I wouldn't mind getting him.

We need to keep our draft picks and draft a QB. Starting QBs Bradford's age are high-priced in trades.

We need to add talent through the draft and FA. Picking in the Top 5 we should be able to get our guy.

[GoSkins]

I also keep forgetting about the possibility of the Rams drafting a QB and wanting to trade away Bradford. I wouldn't mind getting him.

We need to keep our draft picks and draft a QB. Starting QBs Bradford's age are high-priced in trades.

We need to add talent through the draft and FA. Picking in the Top 5 we should be able to get our guy.

I seriously doubt St. Louis will trade Bradford. He's not the problem.

[Irn-Bru]

One of the major early questions about the upcoming draft has een answered.

ESPN’s Chris Mortensen reports that USC tackle Matt Kalil has decided to go pro. Mort believes Kalil is a top-five pick, potentially the premier left tackle in this draft. Matt’s brother Ryan plays for the Panthers and is the highest paid center in football.

We still haven’t heard about USC quarterback Matt Barkley’s status yet. It was believed that whether Kalil stayed would be a bellwether for Barkley’s future. We’d expect Barkley to declare his status sooner than later.

PFT

Awesome. The more talent that gets crowded at the top of the draft, the better for us.

[SkinsJock]

We need to keep our draft picks and draft a QB.

We need to add talent through the draft and FA. Picking in the Top 5 we should be able to get our guy.

I hope we are drafting in the top 5

I hope that Barkley (OR RG III) is available when we pick



I hope our FO & scouting guys have another great draft

I'm hopeful - hope for the best, prepare for the worst

[StorminMormon86]

I see Luck getting picked first, then it's either RGIII or Barkley. If all goes well we'll wind up with one or the other.

[RayNAustin]

Hey, a couple of late wins could push us straight out of the top 10 given so many bunched up at 4-9, 5-8 right now.

Call me those dirty names like Vinny or Danny if you want ... but I'd be inclined to work Indy pretty hard for a shot at Luck ..... I'd offer to swap this years #1 pick, and throw in 2 more .... our #1s for 2013, and 2014.

And I don't think that is crazy at all. Think about 2005 ... we spent 2 #1's on Rogers and Campbell ... neither one are here or lived up to their draft position. In fact, we've blown several #1's over the years.

Luck has all the practical, tangible skills, and the intangibles too. Humble ... good citizen ... team oriented, and absent the self ego that underlies a guy like Cam Newton.

Luck could be the guy that makes 4th round receivers look like 1st round picks ... he could be the next Aaron Rogers of the NFC, and that would be worth WHATEVER you had to spend to get him.

Now the reason I say this is because I don't believe the Redskins are as behind as many others believe. We should have beaten Dallas BOTH games this year, and the game against the Patriots should have been a win too. And aside whatever criticism one might have of the Pats defense, they are still considered one of the prime teams in the league.

Additionally, I believe Hasslett is correct in his view that the defense will make a similar improvement next year over this year (just as they did from last year to this year) because it takes 2-3 years to get everyone comfortable playing a 34.

And I'd go out on a limb and suggest that if we had a prime time QB playing all year THIS YEAR ... we'd be in position to win the NFC East right now, if not already having the division clinched.

[SkinsJock]

1niksder knows the TVC better than anyone

The Colts will probably take 2 #1's PLUS 2 #2s - (this year and next draft)

THAT is a lot to give up - I doubt that they will take less

we should NOT give up ANY draft picks


part of me would love to be in the top 5 - I also hope we win the next 3 games

[RayNAustin]

1niksder knows the TVC better than anyone

The Colts will probably take 2 #1's PLUS 2 #2s - (this year and next draft)

THAT is a lot to give up - I doubt that they will take less

we should NOT give up ANY draft picks


part of me would love to be in the top 5 - I also hope we win the next 3 games

To me, that's not too much to give up .... don't get me wrong, it's still a lot, but I would trade Campbell and Rogers (2-#1s), Kelly and Thomas (2-#2s) for an Aaron Rogers in a HEARTBEAT ... wouldn't you?

Keep in mind something ... as good a player as he is ... Laron Landry (another #1 pick) hasn't been that much of a real impact player such as Sean Taylor was.

There are only a bare few ways of securing a legitimate STUD QB that can become one of those Manning, Brady, Brees, Elway types. 1) you can suck at the perfect time one of them becomes available in the draft (which doesn't happen very often) 2) You can wait for one to appear, and then pay out the gazzoo to get him ... or 3) you can get stupid lucky and pick a Brady that is available in the later rounds who was missed by everyone.

The only option that you can control that doesn't rely on a lot of "dumb luck" is number 2 ... wait till one of those sure things comes along, and have the balls to pull the trigger, and the intestinal fortitude to pay the price.

From the Redskins perspective, I don't think we can afford to rely on good fortune, since the last time we had an ace QB, Moses was parting the Red Sea, and Santana Moss was in diapers. During that time, we've blundered away countless early round draft picks, many of which never became starters, let alone stars.

This upcoming draft is unique, as is Andrew Luck ..... the first thing is, he isn't the only viable QB ... there are 3 good ones, which somewhat reduces the price for that #1 overall pick, however slightly .... and he's regarded as a once per decade type of QB. Indy is in a precarious position and might be willing to deal. And, the Redskins are QB desperate and QB ready, with a solid defense, and some young offensive talent in Helu, Royster, Davis, Hankerson .... some vets like Moss and Gaffney ... some outside speed with AA .... far from lacking talent, we just need a Gun ... we've got plenty of bullets.

I've never been more convinced than I am now that the way to go is to finally utilize the "Danny's" best skill and tell him ... go get us Luck, and prepare to make room in that trophy case for 2013.

Nobody expected Aaron Rogers to be what he's turned out to be ... and he's the reason why the Packers won the SB last year in spite of having half the starting roster on injured reserve. The Pack was decimated with injuries and still took home the trophy. And look at Indy .... who have won 10 -12 games EVERY year Manning has been at the helm and now they can't win 1 game without him?

No need to Suck for Luck ... you just need to Suck it up and pay the buck for Luck.

[SkinsJock]

Hopefully we win the next 3 games

then .... hopefully we draft a bunch of players that can help this franchise

I'd love to get Andrew Luck if he's available when we pick

we would be crippling our franchise if we give up any draft picks to get Andrew Luck


fortunately these guys will not do that

[chiefhog44]

1niksder knows the TVC better than anyone

The Colts will probably take 2 #1's PLUS 2 #2s - (this year and next draft)

THAT is a lot to give up - I doubt that they will take less

we should NOT give up ANY draft picks


part of me would love to be in the top 5 - I also hope we win the next 3 games

To me, that's not too much to give up .... don't get me wrong, it's still a lot, but I would trade Campbell and Rogers (2-#1s), Kelly and Thomas (2-#2s) for an Aaron Rogers in a HEARTBEAT ... wouldn't you?

Keep in mind something ... as good a player as he is ... Laron Landry (another #1 pick) hasn't been that much of a real impact player such as Sean Taylor was.

There are only a bare few ways of securing a legitimate STUD QB that can become one of those Manning, Brady, Brees, Elway types. 1) you can suck at the perfect time one of them becomes available in the draft (which doesn't happen very often) 2) You can wait for one to appear, and then pay out the gazzoo to get him ... or 3) you can get stupid lucky and pick a Brady that is available in the later rounds who was missed by everyone.

The only option that you can control that doesn't rely on a lot of "dumb luck" is number 2 ... wait till one of those sure things comes along, and have the balls to pull the trigger, and the intestinal fortitude to pay the price.

From the Redskins perspective, I don't think we can afford to rely on good fortune, since the last time we had an ace QB, Moses was parting the Red Sea, and Santana Moss was in diapers. During that time, we've blundered away countless early round draft picks, many of which never became starters, let alone stars.

This upcoming draft is unique, as is Andrew Luck ..... the first thing is, he isn't the only viable QB ... there are 3 good ones, which somewhat reduces the price for that #1 overall pick, however slightly .... and he's regarded as a once per decade type of QB. Indy is in a precarious position and might be willing to deal. And, the Redskins are QB desperate and QB ready, with a solid defense, and some young offensive talent in Helu, Royster, Davis, Hankerson .... some vets like Moss and Gaffney ... some outside speed with AA .... far from lacking talent, we just need a Gun ... we've got plenty of bullets.

I've never been more convinced than I am now that the way to go is to finally utilize the "Danny's" best skill and tell him ... go get us Luck, and prepare to make room in that trophy case for 2013.

Nobody expected Aaron Rogers to be what he's turned out to be ... and he's the reason why the Packers won the SB last year in spite of having half the starting roster on injured reserve. The Pack was decimated with injuries and still took home the trophy. And look at Indy .... who have won 10 -12 games EVERY year Manning has been at the helm and now they can't win 1 game without him?

No need to Suck for Luck ... you just need to Suck it up and pay the buck for Luck.

And we're pretty much the only crap team in our conference that needs a QB desperately.

Ray, I think I'm with you on this, but the price will come down. It's like trying to scalp tickets for the big game, and the asking price two months out is always the highest. Wait out the Colts and one up the last team bidding and I bet the asking price is 2 first rounders for Luck. I'd be ok with that if he fits the system.

[1niksder]

1niksder knows the TVC better than anyone

The Colts will probably take 2 #1's PLUS 2 #2s - (this year and next draft)

THAT is a lot to give up - I doubt that they will take less

we should NOT give up ANY draft picks


part of me would love to be in the top 5 - I also hope we win the next 3 games

Ray said 3 ones, I said 2 ones and 2 two. Using the TVC Ray 2590 pts to get to the top of the draft. While I would be giving up 3040 pts to get to the same place.

[skinsfan#33]

A reminder to all of you that think it will only take two 1st and two 2nd round picks to move up and take Luck, let me remind you the idiot Falcons have up two 1st, a 2nd, and two 4th round picks to move up to draft a WR (morons!).

Even though this was a ridiculous deal and Atlanta was much further down in the draft they weren't trading to get "the next Peyton Manning".

We could end up with the 5th overall or as low as 15-18. Of we are drafting outside of the top ten we would have to give up much more than if we were drafting between 5-7. And if we drop to say 16 we shouldn't even consider what it would take to get to get to #1. It certainly will be more than what the draft value chat says, maybe by a much a another 1st.[/b]

[SkinsJock]

Andrew Luck is going to be a VERY, VERY good QB for 10-12 years +

the choice is to get a VERY good QB and have the supporting cast OR get THE GREAT QB and not have the supporting cast


There is NO guarantee that taking Luck leads to success - the odds are better with continuing to build thru the draft


I believe the Colts want Luck but will take a STUPID offer to get a lot of good players rather than just 1 great QB


THANKFULLY this FO will NOT do the stupid thing .... like the last guys in charge here did .... all the time

[StorminMormon86]

I would NEVER give up the farm for Luck...this guy has never played an NFL game in his life. Remember Ryan Leaf?

[BigRedskinDaddy]

As I read this thread one name that to me was conspicuously absent is Russell Wilson. I know he's not prototypical NFL-size, but hey, neither is Drew Brees. I watched this kid play at Wisconsin this year and was very impressed with his poise, his pocket awareness, and his overall field generalship. I wouldn't be too surprised if he goes to some team in the later rounds and turns out to be a steal.

Whether a guy is 6'5" or 5'10", if he's got the arm, can scramble and also throw well on the run, what more can you ask of him?

My two cents...(actually 1 1/2 adjusted for inflation)

[PulpExposure]

A reminder to all of you that think it will only take two 1st and two 2nd round picks to move up and take Luck, let me remind you the idiot Falcons have up two 1st, a 2nd, and two 4th round picks to move up to draft a WR (morons!).

Even though this was a ridiculous deal and Atlanta was much further down in the draft they weren't trading to get "the next Peyton Manning".

We could end up with the 5th overall or as low as 15-18. Of we are drafting outside of the top ten we would have to give up much more than if we were drafting between 5-7. And if we drop to say 16 we shouldn't even consider what it would take to get to get to #1. It certainly will be more than what the draft value chat says, maybe by a much a another 1st.[/b]

Julio Jones is a bad comparison, as the Falcons had to trade up from #27 to #6 to get him.

We don't have to jump 21 spots here. Based on records today, we're jumping 3 spots.

[GoSkins]

Today's performance of teams that need a QB or who have a comparable record to us:


Indianapolis: Won but who cares they're pretty much a lock for 1st pick (1-13)
Miami: Won (5-9)
Carolina: Won (5-9)
KC: Won (6-8)
Seattle: Won (7-7)

Buffalo: Lost (5-9)
St. Louis: Lost (2-12)
Minnesota: Lost (2-12)
Jax: Lost (4-10)
Tampa Bay: Lost (4-10)


TBD:

Cleveland (4-9) We want Cleveland to beat Arizona
Philadelphia (5-9) We want Filthy to beat the Jets

Summary:

We've lost our pick at 4 but if the Browns and Eagles win it looks like the order will be:

1. Colts (1-13)
2. Rams (2-12)
3. Vikings (2-12)
4. Jaquars (4-10)
5. Bucs (4-10)
6. Redskins (5-9)
7. Panthers (5-9)
8. Dolphins (5-9)
9. Browns (5-9) ?
10. Bills (5-9)
11. Chiefs (6-8)
12. Eagles (6-8) ?

If by chance we are at #6 then we still have a good shot at at Griffin or Barkley. The teams with glaring QB needs are the Colts, Redskins, Dolphins, Browns, and Seahawks.

[StorminMormon86]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Jags nabbed a QB too. And they'll most likely get the pick before us. I just hope Griffin and/or Barkley are available when it's our pick.

[Countertrey]

I wouldn't be surprised if the Jags nabbed a QB too. And they'll most likely get the pick before us. I just hope Griffin and/or Barkley are available when it's our pick.

The Jags are the team that is most likely to put together a package to get Luck, i think. New owner... wants to make a statement. He has a pretty ironclad lease, so isn't going to be able to move the team soon... and will want a "STAR" to help pack the stadium... he has watched the "Cam effect" and will want some of that action.

[Chris Luva Luva]

We'll get a QB this year. Bruce has shown himself to be pretty good at not giving up too much.