The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

JansenFan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:Their entire oline is made up of guys that they drafted or signed as unrestricted free agents.

Not to cherry pick, but aren't almost all players either drafted or signed as a UFA? I'm assuming you mean undrafted free agents, otherwise, the same can be said for our line. We'll have three draftees, and two UFA's on our line next year (subject to change depending on RT).

Well, to be fair, players can also be traded for, or be restricted free agents.

SkinsFreak wrote: The team can do no right, ever, no matter what. Because God only knows, you hate Snyder so much, that even the mere semblance of acknowledgment of the team taking positive steps in the right direction, even little steps, you're too afraid that simple acknowledgment might be construed as drinking Snyder's Kool-Aid, and the Lord knows, you can't have any of that. So therefore, no matter what the organization does, it can never be right in your eyes.

Let me translate your own post from an alternative perspective in this thread:

"The team can do no wrong, ever, no matter what. Because God only knows, you love Snyder so much, that even the mere semblance of acknowledgment of the team taking negative steps in the wrong direction, even little steps, you're too afraid that simple criticism might be construed as preparing Snyder's Kool-Aid, and the Lord knows, you can't have any of that. So therefore, no matter what the organization does, it can never be wrong in your eyes."

Gross over-simplification but quite funny actually.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote: The team can do no right, ever, no matter what. Because God only knows, you hate Snyder so much, that even the mere semblance of acknowledgment of the team taking positive steps in the right direction, even little steps, you're too afraid that simple acknowledgment might be construed as drinking Snyder's Kool-Aid, and the Lord knows, you can't have any of that. So therefore, no matter what the organization does, it can never be right in your eyes.

Let me translate your own post from an alternative perspective in this thread:

"The team can do no wrong, ever, no matter what. Because God only knows, you love Snyder so much, that even the mere semblance of acknowledgment of the team taking negative steps in the wrong direction, even little steps, you're too afraid that simple criticism might be construed as preparing Snyder's Kool-Aid, and the Lord knows, you can't have any of that. So therefore, no matter what the organization does, it can never be wrong in your eyes."

Gross over-simplification but quite funny actually.

Thanks for making my point, as you do with the majority of your posts. You see, the majority here, including myself, have acknowledged Snyder's made mistakes in the past and we've never agreed 100% with Snyder. Show a single post where we've said otherwise. But we can also man-up and acknowledge the positive moves as well. That's the difference, RiC, you can't. Acknowledging some positives in no way means you're completely in love with someone, but I can see how you'd immaturely assert that. It's sad and unfortunate you can't distinguish the difference.

JansenFan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:Their entire oline is made up of guys that they drafted or signed as unrestricted free agents.

Not to cherry pick, but aren't almost all players either drafted or signed as a UFA? I'm assuming you mean undrafted free agents, otherwise, the same can be said for our line. We'll have three draftees, and two UFA's on our line next year (subject to change depending on RT).

That's my bad. That was supposed to say undrafted free agents. I looked at their depth chart and 18 or the 19 players listed for offense were either drafted by the Colts or signed as undrafted free agents.

Dude, what roster are you looking at? First, quality is subjective, so perceived quality rankings may vary. With the exception of WR, which I agree we lack depth, I disagree we have no depth at safety, o-line and d-line. We needed a few starters, mind you, but we HAVE depth.

I didn't say that we didn't have depth at dline, read my post. I said that we don't have any depth at defensive end, which we dont. Right now we have Carter and then a bunch of nobodies in Buzbee, Wilson, and Rob Jackson.

Linebacker is another position we have no depth at. We have Blades in the middle as depth, which is solid, but who on the roster do you feel comfortable with either taking over for MW or replacing Rocky is he gets hurt?

Offensive line...sure we have a decent number of offensive linemen on the roster but that doesn't mean that we have quality depth. If we had any sort of solid depth there we would have had players that we could have turned to last season when our line was playing like garbage. An aging line with no young players ready to step up and take over = no depth.

rob jackson for president

SkinsFreak wrote: Thanks for making my point, as you do with the majority of your posts. You see, the majority here, including myself, have acknowledged Snyder's made mistakes in the past and we've never agreed 100% with Snyder. Show a single post where we've said otherwise. But we can also man-up and acknowledge the positive moves as well. That's the difference, RiC, you can't. Acknowledging some positives in no way means you're completely in love with someone, but I can see how you'd immaturely assert that. It's sad and unfortunate you can't distinguish the difference.

The FACT that some of you guys CONSISTENTLY ignore that the Danny is first and foremost a MARKETING and PUBLIC RELATIONS MAN and he is not and he will never be an NFL expert does not seem to register.

Can Dan Snyder pick expensive players both to fill needs and as publicity stunts. SURE!

Does he have the knowledge, competence, patience and expertise to put together a TEAM that will win a Lonbardi Trophy, unfortunately no.

His main enemies are his own ego and greed. One would think that after so many years of REPEATED failure from a fundamentally flawed approach to manage the Team he would have appointed a competent GM. But a competent GM may mean a sacrifice to his ego and his greed.

So, for as long as his fundamental personality flaws transmit all the way from the FO on to the field, it is very difficult to expect a Championship.

Dream on.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote: Thanks for making my point, as you do with the majority of your posts. You see, the majority here, including myself, have acknowledged Snyder's made mistakes in the past and we've never agreed 100% with Snyder. Show a single post where we've said otherwise. But we can also man-up and acknowledge the positive moves as well. That's the difference, RiC, you can't. Acknowledging some positives in no way means you're completely in love with someone, but I can see how you'd immaturely assert that. It's sad and unfortunate you can't distinguish the difference.

The FACT that some of you guys CONSISTENTLY ignore that the Danny is first and foremost a MARKETING and PUBLIC RELATIONS MAN and he is not and he will never be an NFL expert does not seem to register.

Can Dan Snyder pick expensive players both to fill needs and as publicity stunts. SURE!

Does he have the knowledge, competence, patience and expertise to put together a TEAM that will win a Lonbardi Trophy, unfortunately no.

His main enemies are his own ego and greed. One would think that after so many years of REPEATED failure from a fundamentally flawed approach to manage the Team he would have appointed a competent GM. But a competent GM may mean a sacrifice to his ego and his greed.

So, for as long as his fundamental personality flaws transmit all the way from the FO on to the field, it is very difficult to expect a Championship.

Dream on.

I tried reading this post, but it didn't make any sense. I'm going to put it through babel fish and see if I can get it translated into "grownup".

SF is absolutely right in this case anyway. You are completely incapable of admitting anything positive with Snyder and Vinny because that would make it seem like you're drinking the kool aid because of your black and white views on everything.

The fact is people learn and change. Is Snyder the same guy who bought the team ten years ago? No, he's made mistakes and learned from them. This isn't the same guy who signed Deion Sanders, Bruce Smith or Mark Carrier.

This is the guy who was in charge when they drafted Sean Taylor over Kellen Winslow, who was in charge when they drafted ey. Who signed Shawn Springs, Marcus Washington, Cornelius Griffin... who signed Zorn when there were other "celebrity coaches" available and who consistently tries to put the best product on the field.

Sometimes you just have to blame the players when things don't go right. Don't be lazy, and don't delude yourself into thinking the owner is the cause of all the team's problems.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote: Thanks for making my point, as you do with the majority of your posts. You see, the majority here, including myself, have acknowledged Snyder's made mistakes in the past and we've never agreed 100% with Snyder. Show a single post where we've said otherwise. But we can also man-up and acknowledge the positive moves as well. That's the difference, RiC, you can't. Acknowledging some positives in no way means you're completely in love with someone, but I can see how you'd immaturely assert that. It's sad and unfortunate you can't distinguish the difference.

The FACT that some of you guys CONSISTENTLY ignore that the Danny is first and foremost a MARKETING and PUBLIC RELATIONS MAN and he is not and he will never be an NFL expert does not seem to register.

Can Dan Snyder pick expensive players both to fill needs and as publicity stunts. SURE!

Does he have the knowledge, competence, patience and expertise to put together a TEAM that will win a Lonbardi Trophy, unfortunately no.

His main enemies are his own ego and greed. One would think that after so many years of REPEATED failure from a fundamentally flawed approach to manage the Team he would have appointed a competent GM. But a competent GM may mean a sacrifice to his ego and his greed.

So, for as long as his fundamental personality flaws transmit all the way from the FO on to the field, it is very difficult to expect a Championship.

Dream on.

I don't see anyone here calling Snyder an expert. And that's the point, RiC. Just because some of us like the recent moves the team has made, in no way suggests anyone thinks Snyder is an NFL expert or anyone is enamored with Snyder. That's what I'm talking about when I say that a few like you unfortunately can't make that distinction.

Everyone here has agreed, to a large degree, that Snyder has made mistakes and no one agrees with everything he does. But there's also a rational, logical and objective perspective that some moves have been wise. You refuse to admit that because you think if you do, someone, just like you, would accuse you of being in love with Snyder.

If you don't think they can work towards a championship, fine, that's your prerogative. But this is a game and a sport, so don't crap on the vast majority that plainly recognize that there have been good moves made. If you believe it's solely about greed and marketing, fine, but ignoring the facts and the numerous counter points made here doesn't make it so.

And besides, the best way to increase profits and market your team would be to win a Super Bowl. You consistently assert Snyder cares more about marketing and making money while caring less about winning a Super Bowl. Yet winning that Super Bowl would instantly increase his profits and is the best way to market your product. So your assertions are contradictions of logic.

SkinsFreak wrote:And besides, the best way to increase profits and market your team would be to win a Super Bowl. You consistently assert Snyder cares more about marketing and making money while caring less about winning a Super Bowl. Yet winning that Super Bowl would instantly increase his profits and is the best way to market your product. So your assertions are contradictions of logic.

Sure. The ONLY problem is that his prorities would have to be straight. They are not.

His EGO is first and the Championship second. He does not see that the first is obstructing his way to the second.

I could care less if the guy makes trillions. ALL he has to do is MOVE ASIDE and do what successful franchises and ownerships do: He must appoint the best GM that can be found in the NFL. Very simple. That's all.

I do not have illusions about gathering tons of support for my outspoken views here. Nobody likes to swallow tough medicine and the statement "for as long as DS runs the Team, we are in trouble" prevents members from enjoying the enthusiasm of a new season.

You guys have A LOT less patience with players and coaches when they do not perform. You can argue that none of us can really do anything to change the owner but the same can be said about the players. We are spectators and the only way we have to express our displeasure with the operations of the Team is to stop buying into it.

Unfortunately, it is beginning to happen. I am not alone in being fed up with this guy and his current staff at the FO. It often takes a few embarrasing performances during the regular season to turn the enthusiasm fed over the off-season through expensive acquisitions into a very negative and unpleasant crowd around here.

I ask, Why? This is a chronicle of a failure foretold.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote:And besides, the best way to increase profits and market your team would be to win a Super Bowl. You consistently assert Snyder cares more about marketing and making money while caring less about winning a Super Bowl. Yet winning that Super Bowl would instantly increase his profits and is the best way to market your product. So your assertions are contradictions of logic.

Sure. The ONLY problem is that his prorities would have to be straight. They are not.

His EGO is first and the Championship second. He does not see that the first is obstructing his way to the second.

This FO is the personification of Albert Einstein's definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Snyder covets being seen as the one responsible for the success this team might achieve MORE that the success itself. He won't allow himself to acknowledge "someone else can do this better than I can" and hand the keys to someone else.

This is the one and only thing Snyder has left to learn. The best NFL owners are figurehead owners.

I could care less if the guy makes trillions. ALL he has to do is MOVE ASIDE and do what successful franchises and ownerships do: He must appoint the best GM that can be found in the NFL. Very simple. That's all.

Yes, it's easy. Just ask guys named Irsay, Kraft and Rooney. IIRC, they only make their presence felt on Fan Appreciation Day and in the locker room after late-season and post-season wins -- when they shake hands with an NFL executive and hold up a trophy.

I do not have illusions about gathering tons of support for my outspoken views here. Nobody likes to swallow tough medicine and the statement "for as long as DS runs the Team, we are in trouble" prevents members from enjoying the enthusiasm of a new season.

Well, you have mine. All they need to do take notice at what the Capitals did yesterday.

There were probably moves that could have been made that would have improved the team this year and their chances of winning the Cup this year ... but they passed on everything. The mantra there is "We don't want to win just this year, we want to win for MANY years."

A Snyder-led team would not have been capable of that.

Unfortunately, it is beginning to happen. I am not alone in being fed up with this guy and his current staff at the FO. It often takes a few embarrasing performances during the regular season to turn the enthusiasm fed over the off-season through expensive acquisitions into a very negative and unpleasant crowd around here.

I ask, Why? This is a chronicle of a failure foretold.

I woke up last week to the Haynesworth news and -- to this moment -- felt a complete sense of indifference to it all.

We've "been there, done this" part of the process for years. This part is old hat. And, in every year prior, we've seen that this team has been incapable of translating the offseason buzz into in-season success.

The fact is people learn and change. Is Snyder the same guy who bought the team ten years ago? No, he's made mistakes and learned from them. This isn't the same guy who signed Deion Sanders, Bruce Smith or Mark Carrier.

This is the guy who was in charge when they drafted Sean Taylor over Kellen Winslow, who was in charge when they drafted ey. Who signed Shawn Springs, Marcus Washington, Cornelius Griffin

He's also the guy that oversaw us waste a second round pick on Boonell when he was about to be cut by the Jags. Under his watch in recent years we traded 2 draft picks for Taylor, 2 picks for TJ Duckett, 2 picks for Brandon Lloyd, and a pick for Erasmus James. Seven draft choices for 3.5 sacks and 2 td's. He also oversaw the signing of Archuleta (huge mistake) and ARE, who makes way more money than he deserves. You say that he has learned but all of the above moves were made during the past couple of off-seasons. This year we only have 4 draft picks and we are already missing one for next year because of the Taylor trade. He hasn't learned jack.

who signed Zorn when there were other "celebrity coaches" available and who consistently tries to put the best product on the field.

Maybe I missed it, but what has Zorn done to deserve his hiring being labeled a success? He was heralded as a qb guru and yet JC showed only marginal improvement and tanked during the second half of the season. The only part of the offense that was successful was the running game that was left over from Joe Gibbs, while the passing game that Zorn installed was completely inept. He also managed to get into a media fight with our best player. Meanwhile two rookie head coaches were busy taking their teams to the playoffs. Zorn may turn out to be a good hire, but at this point it's not looking all that good.

RedskinsFreak wrote:

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote:And besides, the best way to increase profits and market your team would be to win a Super Bowl. You consistently assert Snyder cares more about marketing and making money while caring less about winning a Super Bowl. Yet winning that Super Bowl would instantly increase his profits and is the best way to market your product. So your assertions are contradictions of logic.

Sure. The ONLY problem is that his prorities would have to be straight. They are not.

His EGO is first and the Championship second. He does not see that the first is obstructing his way to the second.

This FO is the personification of Albert Einstein's definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Snyder covets being seen as the one responsible for the success this team might achieve MORE that the success itself. He won't allow himself to acknowledge "someone else can do this better than I can" and hand the keys to someone else.

This is the one and only thing Snyder has left to learn. The best NFL owners are figurehead owners.

I could care less if the guy makes trillions. ALL he has to do is MOVE ASIDE and do what successful franchises and ownerships do: He must appoint the best GM that can be found in the NFL. Very simple. That's all.

Yes, it's easy. Just ask guys named Irsay, Kraft and Rooney. IIRC, they only make their presence felt on Fan Appreciation Day and in the locker room after late-season and post-season wins -- when they shake hands with an NFL executive and hold up a trophy.

I do not have illusions about gathering tons of support for my outspoken views here. Nobody likes to swallow tough medicine and the statement "for as long as DS runs the Team, we are in trouble" prevents members from enjoying the enthusiasm of a new season.

Well, you have mine. All they need to do take notice at what the Capitals did yesterday.

There were probably moves that could have been made that would have improved the team this year and their chances of winning the Cup this year ... but they passed on everything. The mantra there is "We don't want to win just this year, we want to win for MANY years."

A Snyder-led team would not have been capable of that.

Unfortunately, it is beginning to happen. I am not alone in being fed up with this guy and his current staff at the FO. It often takes a few embarrasing performances during the regular season to turn the enthusiasm fed over the off-season through expensive acquisitions into a very negative and unpleasant crowd around here.

I ask, Why? This is a chronicle of a failure foretold.

I woke up last week to the Haynesworth news and -- to this moment -- felt a complete sense of indifference to it all.

We've "been there, done this" part of the process for years. This part is old hat. And, in every year prior, we've seen that this team has been incapable of translating the offseason buzz into in-season success.

Excellent points.

His EGO is first and the Championship second. He does not see that the first is obstructing his way to the second.

And yet the team could get on a roll and win one...I can't believe I'm going to say this but if they did... IMO it would be bad for the organization because DS would never see a need for change!! Take a look at TtiT!!

He knows we hate him, he knows it... And thats why he's so determined to prove us wrong. Just as many have just said, it's his ego. He needs to be responsible for the turnaround and to spite us. LOL

I felt the same way as a previous poster after the Phat Albert signing: indifferent.

I've seen this type of signing/trade before during the last ten years and the team on the field has barely been above mediocre.

As RiC and a couple more have said, it's sad that Snyder can lure away criticism from the fans by signing one big-time free agent after another practically every year. "Well, at least he´s trying to be successfull by getting the best players available", you say.

Nonsense. The manly thing to do would be to step aside, throw a couple milion at the best GM out there and install a serious plan for this team NOW.

We have little depth at crucial positions that simply cannot be filled with FAs in one season (WR, Oline, Dline, LB). They requiere years of careful drafting. Has this organization done that during the last ten years? NO.

I think Joe Gibbs said it best during the 1991 season: "you´re only as good as your backups".

Until the owner starts to realize that this is not his private Fantasy Football team, I'll keep my expectations medium during every season.

it would make for a great meeting the fans and snyder reunite victorious after winning the super bowl and dallas fans are still crappy ha ha what a
a headline for papers all across the nation. If we could only play "we are the champions my friends" while people read that in households all across the nation. I will rest assured to that vinny and mr. snyder will both stay there in there luxury box too, probably making note of the amont we lost in parking fees because the game was not at fed ex. Seriously if there was a GM for hire who and how much would that cost?????

redskins14ru wrote:Seriously if there was a GM for hire who and how much would that cost?????

The best acquisition of the offseason was not a player, it was a GM andit was made by the KC Chiefs: Pioli.

There is no cap number for GM.

He was available and ripe for the taking. But he would have wanted control over personnel acquisition, scout team selection and no interference from the owner, and the Danny would not give it up.

It would have solved our QB situation too ... Just saying.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

redskins14ru wrote:Seriously if there was a GM for hire who and how much would that cost?????

The best acquisition of the offseason was not a player, it was a GM andit was made by the KC Chiefs: Pioli.

There is no cap number for GM.

He was available and ripe for the taking. But he would have wanted control over personnel acquisition, scout team selection and no interference from the owner, and the Danny would not give it up.

It would have solved our QB situation too ... Just saying.

So you're saying that Cassel is a lock to be a long term franchise quarterback? That's presumptuous considering he hasn't even played a full season. While he had a stretch of good games, it's still to be determined if he was not just a product of a system that uses a lot of short passing and screen plays. The jury is still out on this guy.

MakeRomoCry wrote:

Redskin in Canada wrote:

redskins14ru wrote:Seriously if there was a GM for hire who and how much would that cost?????

The best acquisition of the offseason was not a player, it was a GM andit was made by the KC Chiefs: Pioli.

There is no cap number for GM.

He was available and ripe for the taking. But he would have wanted control over personnel acquisition, scout team selection and no interference from the owner, and the Danny would not give it up.

It would have solved our QB situation too ... Just saying.

So you're saying that Cassel is a lock to be a long term franchise quarterback? That's presumptuous considering he hasn't even played a full season. While he had a stretch of good games, it's still to be determined if he was not just a product of a system that uses a lot of short passing and screen plays. The jury is still out on this guy.

Who knows if he is a long term franchise qb. I would definitely take him over JC at this point though.

How can snyder be called greedy and careless with money at the same time/

Shh, some people just need to have a scapegoat to complain about.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Shh, some people just need to have a scapegoat to complain about.

Bob 0119 wrote:

Skinsfan55 wrote:Shh, some people just need to have a scapegoat to complain about.

Both of you are right. Nobody is really accountable for the results. They just happen. It must be the luck of the draw. I have my ticket for next season's raffle.

willcamp17 wrote:How can snyder be called greedy and careless with money at the same time/

Good question. Here it goes:

1) He is greedy because he squeezes every penny off the fans' pocket with an overpriced and mediocre product.

2)He is careless because there is a CAP which must be spent judiciously to optimise the OVERALL performance of your TEAM.