The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Fios wrote:I don't see why this can't be both a cap issue and a workout issue. Yes, it makes sense that the Redskins would like to get out from under an $8 million payment and, yes, it also makes sense that they would have a vested interest in monitoring a player who suffered a potentially debilitating issue before they spent that money.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

riggofan wrote:

Bob 0119 wrote:

Countertrey wrote:Reading between the lines, one has to wonder if there was not concern that Taylor was putting adequate effort into rehabing his injured calf muscle. Compartment syndrome can cause serious damage to both muscle and nerve tissue. The team had clearly made a statement that they intended to stay with Taylor and his 8.5 mil salary. Why was this one issue so critical to them?

Had Taylor been dogging it, not putting forth the effort to fully regain strength in that calf? I've not seen them make this an issue for other players. Why this one? Why now?

I think you're on the right track. I certainly believe they wanted to watch him more closely, whether it was strictly due to his rehab, or just to improve his on-field performance like they did with CP last year.

Nah, I'm not buying that.

I've been thinking about this story lately too. Does anybody really believe this nonsense? If the Redskins really wanted Jason Taylor, a 34 year old vet and former probowler, would they seriously have released him for not working out with the team at nonmandatory sessions? That's just such a weak story, we should all be insulted by it. Its like the disgraced politician who resigns to "spend more time with his family".

So my question really is why the silly story? Why not just say this didn't work out, we need the cap space or whatever and release him? Its not like anybody would have been surprised. And I don't see how this goofy OTA story makes either Taylor or the Redskins look any better. It makes Taylor look uncommitted and/or lazy, and it makes the Redskins look stupid and abitrary.

Does it make any difference to you that Taylor's reason for not making the deal was that exact same politician's excuse? Like you said, why not just say it didn't work out or it was a cap issue if that was the real cause? I have to think they are being honest, because he could have just as well said, OK, and then they'd have been screwed. It's a pretty big gamble just to save a little face.

Have you ever heard of a team releasing a starter for not attending non-mandatory workouts?

PulpExposure wrote:

Fios wrote:I don't see why this can't be both a cap issue and a workout issue. Yes, it makes sense that the Redskins would like to get out from under an $8 million payment and, yes, it also makes sense that they would have a vested interest in monitoring a player who suffered a potentially debilitating issue before they spent that money.

Exactly. They probably did a cost-benefit analysis on Taylor, and probably thought that prior to this, he was (barely) worth retaining. However, the fact that he couldn't commit to coming to DC for 39 workouts over 13 weeks...pushed them to releasing him.

Countertrey wrote:If it were about the cap alone, they would have just cut him, just like any other player on the downward arc of his career. No face to save... it's a straight up 8.5 mil cap savings. Theres more to it. There's a reason they wanted those workouts to be mandatory.

Skinsfan55 wrote:If every team had a crystal ball to go back and make great picks, the Lions, Chiefs, Raiders etc. would be the world's finest teams.

The fact is that at the time Taylor Jacobs was considered first round talent and Cliff Russell was probably the fastest WR in the draft.

Neither one were able to earn playing time, and that's too bad. But it happens to the best teams. The Colts and Pats are probably two of the best teams when if comes to the draft. Not every pick they make is gold, you miss on a couple. It's not an exact science.

Still, given the chance to do it over again, they'd probably still take Jacobs because he was a track star WR who was productive at a major college program.

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:1st Round talents that drop to the second round and are busts are not 1st round talents.

Does it make any difference to you that Taylor's reason for not making the deal was that exact same politician's excuse?

Yeah, I "buy" the story... any alternative motives seem like conspiracy theories.

SkinsFreak wrote:

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:1st Round talents that drop to the second round and are busts are not 1st round talents.

Clinton Portis was a 1st round talent that slipped into the 2nd round before being drafted by Denver with the 51st pick overall. Was he a bust?

SkinsFreak wrote:

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:1st Round talents that drop to the second round and are busts are not 1st round talents.

Clinton Portis was a 1st round talent that slipped into the 2nd round before being drafted by Denver with the 51st pick overall. Was he a bust?

There will always be bad picks made in every round of the draft, Wahoo. That doesn't prove anything. There were 4-5 WR's considered to have 1st round talent last year, but no WR's were selected in the 1st round. However, ten were selected in the 2nd round. Are they all busts too?

PulpExposure wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote:

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:1st Round talents that drop to the second round and are busts are not 1st round talents.

Clinton Portis was a 1st round talent that slipped into the 2nd round before being drafted by Denver with the 51st pick overall. Was he a bust?

Fred Smoot was another. Dropped because of character concerns.

And Wahoo, one thing about the FO is we have hit on our first round draft picks. It's actually pretty impressive; if you look at other teams' history, they often miss on 1st rounders.

For example, people think the Eagles and Ravens are great drafters; and overall, they are. However, both teams have had noticeable misses in the first round (Travis Taylor/Mark Clayton/Kyle Boller for the Ravens, Freddie Mitchell/Jerome McDougle). You'd have to go back to probably Andre Johnson in 1996 for a Redskins 1st round draft pick to have noticeably failed a la one of the aforementioned players. Hell, even Rod Gardner played for another team after the Skins, whereas those guys mentioned above couldn't find regular playing time with any team after being released.

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:For a trip down memory lane, let's remember how Clinton came to the Skins. We traded for him and gave up possibly the rarest commodity in pro football...a shutdown corner. And what did the Broncos do? They found three more running backs to take Clinton's place including multiple 1000 yd rushers and 2 more division championships.
Don't get me wrong, I love having Clinton on the team, but to give up Champ? And furthermore, why is Champ the only guy that Snyder not "shown the money"?

"1st Round talents that drop to the second round and are busts are not 1st round talents. "

$500,000 to work out between the months of March and June - just to work out. Then an upcoming salary of $9,000,000 - for one season of play. One season! You would really have to hate to be somewhere to turn down ten million dollars for the next ten months of work. I mean, I know Miami is pretty nice, but just go ahead and make that much money while you still can and then retire anywhere you want. Hell, I would go play in Russia for 10,000,000. I would pack my bags and fly out tomorrow, "Ill see ya in February."

Jason allegedly turned down the $500,000 offer to work out with the Redskins for the off season. When the request was denied the Skins released his rights for the last season of his contract. This was obviously no surprise to JT, who wanted to stay with his family, where they live in Miami.

Now I feel like I'm judging too much and I definitely can't be that guy. Last off season I had a workout bonus of $100,000 to make 80 percent of my workouts and didn't reach it. Granted I got married and missed 10 days for my honeymoon, but I also took a week trip for Drew Brees charity. I was still very close to making the percentage. So just stating the facts of the off season program that I have been a part of for the last five years will suffice.

We will have actual workouts starting on March 16th going into May. These are the weight lifting, running, gaining strength at the gym type of workouts that anyone would expect. Of course we work very hard, but when I go into Redskins park for this type of work I spend no more than three hours in the facility. The requirements for each week are to workout four days and it can be for any four days throughout the week. Mon - Thurs, Tues - Fri or whatever combination of four days you want to make, this schedule also allows a four day weekend every week. Between the months of March and April there will be 28 of these required workouts. As May begins we get into what is called an OTA schedule.(Optional Training Activity) These will be like mini practice days. We will meet in the morning and install plays for the first couple hours, have quick lunch, then go on the field for about an hour and a half. The practices are at a quick tempo, but we wear only helmets, so little contact is involved. The day will usually last from 9 in the morning until 3 in the after noon. The requirements for the off-season end June 12. The total amount of optional/mandatory days is 52.

For JT to reach his 75 percent requirement of the deal would have had to be hear for 39 days. Had he arrived and worked for the 39 days he would have been compensated $12,820 per day. That is unreal to me! Most people pay their own money to go to the gym, but almost 13 thousand dollars a day is a pretty good membership in the other direction. Again, I will not judge this decision and I have no idea what his bank account could possibly be, but that's a (expletive deleted) ton of money. As for my end of the off season, I will be required to make 42 days to reach my bonus. I again would receive a check grossing $100,000. This would pay me $2300 per workout. Still pretty awesome and enough to get me into the gym.

Cooter wrote:The Redskins online store is trying to unload all of J. Taylor's jersey's; pre-order a Haynesworth jersey and get a J. Taylor jersey for free, LOL. I'll tell them to keep the jersey and give me free shipping.

DEHog wrote:There is already a thread on DS Greed

SkinsFreak wrote:Back on topic... however... damn near every expert on NFLN has agreed the Skins made the right move by signing Haynesworth and releasing Taylor.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Chris ey weighs in on the Jason Taylor situation from his blog:

$500,000 to work out between the months of March and June - just to work out. Then an upcoming salary of $9,000,000 - for one season of play. One season! You would really have to hate to be somewhere to turn down ten million dollars for the next ten months of work. I mean, I know Miami is pretty nice, but just go ahead and make that much money while you still can and then retire anywhere you want. Hell, I would go play in Russia for 10,000,000. I would pack my bags and fly out tomorrow, "Ill see ya in February."

Jason allegedly turned down the $500,000 offer to work out with the Redskins for the off season. When the request was denied the Skins released his rights for the last season of his contract. This was obviously no surprise to JT, who wanted to stay with his family, where they live in Miami.

Now I feel like I'm judging too much and I definitely can't be that guy. Last off season I had a workout bonus of $100,000 to make 80 percent of my workouts and didn't reach it. Granted I got married and missed 10 days for my honeymoon, but I also took a week trip for Drew Brees charity. I was still very close to making the percentage. So just stating the facts of the off season program that I have been a part of for the last five years will suffice.

We will have actual workouts starting on March 16th going into May. These are the weight lifting, running, gaining strength at the gym type of workouts that anyone would expect. Of course we work very hard, but when I go into Redskins park for this type of work I spend no more than three hours in the facility. The requirements for each week are to workout four days and it can be for any four days throughout the week. Mon - Thurs, Tues - Fri or whatever combination of four days you want to make, this schedule also allows a four day weekend every week. Between the months of March and April there will be 28 of these required workouts. As May begins we get into what is called an OTA schedule.(Optional Training Activity) These will be like mini practice days. We will meet in the morning and install plays for the first couple hours, have quick lunch, then go on the field for about an hour and a half. The practices are at a quick tempo, but we wear only helmets, so little contact is involved. The day will usually last from 9 in the morning until 3 in the after noon. The requirements for the off-season end June 12. The total amount of optional/mandatory days is 52.

For JT to reach his 75 percent requirement of the deal would have had to be hear for 39 days. Had he arrived and worked for the 39 days he would have been compensated $12,820 per day. That is unreal to me! Most people pay their own money to go to the gym, but almost 13 thousand dollars a day is a pretty good membership in the other direction. Again, I will not judge this decision and I have no idea what his bank account could possibly be, but that's a (expletive deleted) ton of money. As for my end of the off season, I will be required to make 42 days to reach my bonus. I again would receive a check grossing $100,000. This would pay me $2300 per workout. Still pretty awesome and enough to get me into the gym.

SkinsJock wrote:

SkinsFreak wrote:Back on topic... however... damn near every expert on NFLN has agreed the Skins made the right move by signing Haynesworth and releasing Taylor.

Is that really so? I thought that most "experts" agreed with the fact that Taylor would benefit from having a DT like Fat Albert as would the line, the linebackers and the secondary.

To imply that these same people agreed with the signing AND thought we were correct in not signing Taylor because he would not agree to make a workout commitment is misleading in my opinion. Maybe that's what you intended

Most "experts" felt we gave Fat Albert too much money even when factored over 4 years

I also felt that most "experts" thought that the team was right in asking for a commitment from Taylor and that he made a mistake by both not staying for another year and also for not trying to at least see if he couldn't make amends for not playing up to his salary last season

SkinsJock wrote:Try calling Pat Kirwin up and asking for his opinions on the Skin's signing Haynesworth - not the fact that Fat Albert might be a help to the Skin's defense but the contract itself - there is a difference - he seems to have a slightly different opinion - just saying ....

I'll say it again, all teams need depth - we need a lot of help in the next 3 years on offense and we also have a defense that relies on player rotation, but, instead of acquiring a number of players on the defensive side, our FO brain trust brought in Fat Albert and seem to think that single player will address our defensive needs - NOT HAPPENING - just my opinion, but we will see if Cerrato and Snyder can finally get lucky.