Dre Bly wants to be a Skin

[1niksder]

Until we get a proven pass rush we can't expect any DB to come in here annihilate people.

Can we expect whoever the CB is to actually go out and play CB for the team? Or will he be on the sidelines for most of the season.

[Fios]

I'm not conviced Dre Bly is, frankly, that good of a player.

Every time I see him play, he's closer to Ade Jimoh and Kenny Wright than to Springs, Smoot or even Rogers.

I don't think that he is even a top 20 CB

What? Are you kidding???

Bly ranks 4th in career interceptions among current active defensive backs, only 6 behind Bailey. Yeah, I guess that knocks him out of the top 20.

Springs a better corner?

Over the last 2 years:

INTS:
Springs - 2
Bly - 9

Passes Defended:
Springs - 15
Bly - 24

Forced Fumbles:
Springs - 0
Bly - 7

My history is a little fuzzy. Where did we rank in pass defense and turnovers last year?

Nope, not kidding. Springs was out or lame for more than half of 06 and his pass defenses are down because of that.

INT are almost always a result of good preasure on the QB, not great DB play. The Ravens lead the NFL with 28 picks and were second in sacks. We were last in the NFL with 6 picks, guess where we finished in sacks (last)? Now Detroit didn't put a lot of preasure on the QB, but they did have 11 more sacks than the Skins. So Bly's old team put more preasure on the QB than the Skins.

Last year Bly was 38th in thr NFL in tackels (CB only), 37th in INts, and 13th in passes defensed.

IN 05 he was 65th in tackles (CB only), 8th in INTs, and 28th in pass defenses.

GW's defenses have historically almost always ranked low in turn overs and sacks.


Pass defenses are a better indication of the play in the secondary.

You're just wrong about him not being a top 20 corner, that's ridiculous. Detroit was terrible across-the-board on defense last season and, in the same fashion that it's unfair to vilify Taylor or Rogers for the Redskins awful D, you can't cite ONE season and make that kind of conclusion. Last year Bly had three times as many picks as ANY of the Skins DBs. And who cares about the tackles, you shouldn't be asking your CB to be among the leaders in tackles, something has gone terribly wrong if that is the case. Bly was ONE pick away from being in the top 20 DBs in the league. And your pass defended stat is wrong, he was 12th in the league. And you're seriously going to point to ELEVEN more sacks over 16 games as a significant factor? Why do you think Detroit has identified getting a pass rush as one of their off-season priorities?

[Chris Luva Luva]

Until we get a proven pass rush we can't expect any DB to come in here annihilate people.

Can we expect whoever the CB is to actually go out and play CB for the team? Or will he be on the sidelines for most of the season.

That wasn't really a knock on Bly at all. Your point is received but I'm moreso focused on the pass rush. If you truely want my opinion we should just get Ryan Clark back who we used as a CB and safety.

[1niksder]

Until we get a proven pass rush we can't expect any DB to come in here annihilate people.

Can we expect whoever the CB is to actually go out and play CB for the team? Or will he be on the sidelines for most of the season.

That wasn't really a knock on Bly at all. Your point is received but I'm moreso focused on the pass rush. If you truely want my opinion we should just get Ryan Clark back who we used as a CB and safety.

I hear what your saying about the pass rush and I agree, I was more or less pointing out the fact to those they ARE knocking Bly when comparing his play to that of Springs. One played last year and one played sometimes... the that played would be cheaper than the one that played sometimes. One says he wants to be a Redskin and is hot about the fact that he isn't, the other says he wants to be a Redskin but it's up to the team weather he stays or not (when really it's up to him).

[Mursilis]

One says he wants to be a Redskin and is hot about the fact that he isn't, the other says he wants to be a Redskin but it's up to the team weather he stays or not (when really it's up to him).

I don't buy either of those lines. Bly just wants to get paid. Do you really think that if Denver actually agreed to grant him a new contract, he'd still want to come to Washington? I don't think so. And regarding Springs, it is up to the team, at least as much as it's up to Springs. Springs has already said he'd happily play for us under his current contract. If the team can't live with those terms, tough. They weren't forced to agree to that contract any more than Springs was.

[SkinsFreak]

Nope, not kidding. Springs was out or lame for more than half of 06 and his pass defenses are down because of that.

Right. So that adds another negative aspect to Springs. In the game of football, injuries and missed games are significant and relevant. Fios already covered my other rebuttals so I'll leave it at that.

[Fios]

One says he wants to be a Redskin and is hot about the fact that he isn't, the other says he wants to be a Redskin but it's up to the team weather he stays or not (when really it's up to him).

I don't buy either of those lines. Bly just wants to get paid. Do you really think that if Denver actually agreed to grant him a new contract, he'd still want to come to Washington? I don't think so. And regarding Springs, it is up to the team, at least as much as it's up to Springs. Springs has already said he'd happily play for us under his current contract. If the team can't live with those terms, tough. They weren't forced to agree to that contract any more than Springs was.

From another thread:

Folks, you should probably know the facts before you judge Bly

And SEVERAL players have restructured, it is common practice throughout the league so, yes, the ball is in Springs' court.

[SkinsFreak]

One says he wants to be a Redskin and is hot about the fact that he isn't, the other says he wants to be a Redskin but it's up to the team weather he stays or not (when really it's up to him).

I don't buy either of those lines. Bly just wants to get paid. Do you really think that if Denver actually agreed to grant him a new contract, he'd still want to come to Washington? I don't think so. And regarding Springs, it is up to the team, at least as much as it's up to Springs. Springs has already said he'd happily play for us under his current contract. If the team can't live with those terms, tough. They weren't forced to agree to that contract any more than Springs was.

From another thread:

Folks, you should probably know the facts before you judge Bly

And SEVERAL players have restructured, it is common practice throughout the league so, yes, the ball is in Springs' court.

If it was me ... and maybe this makes me a money-grubbing whore, but I'd be pissed off. I'd whine, cry, and pout until until I forced my way to Washington. If I thought it would help, I'd burn down Invesco Field, insult Rod Smith's mother, and show up to a press conference wearing a t-shirt that read, "John Elway was Overrated."

[Mursilis]

One says he wants to be a Redskin and is hot about the fact that he isn't, the other says he wants to be a Redskin but it's up to the team weather he stays or not (when really it's up to him).

I don't buy either of those lines. Bly just wants to get paid. Do you really think that if Denver actually agreed to grant him a new contract, he'd still want to come to Washington? I don't think so. And regarding Springs, it is up to the team, at least as much as it's up to Springs. Springs has already said he'd happily play for us under his current contract. If the team can't live with those terms, tough. They weren't forced to agree to that contract any more than Springs was.

From another thread:

Folks, you should probably know the facts before you judge Bly

OK, I don't get it - that just seems to confirm what I was saying. Bly doesn't want to come here because he loves this team - he wants to come here because we've offered the most money. If Denver offered to match our terms (but they won't), I imagine his response would be "Washington Who?".

And SEVERAL players have restructured, it is common practice throughout the league so, yes, the ball is in Springs' court.

Yes, obviously restructured contracts get done every year, but isn't the team actually talking about a salary cut, not just a restructure? And Springs has already responded - by saying no. Clearly, the next move seems to belong to the team - pay him, deal him, or cut him.

[1niksder]

Nope, not kidding. Springs was out or lame for more than half of 06 and his pass defenses are down because of that.

Right. So that adds another negative aspect to Springs. In the game of football, injuries and missed games are significant and relevant. Fios already covered my other rebuttals so I'll leave it at that.

In 8 years Bly has missed 9 games and is coming off a year where he played every game. Springs missed 7 last year alone and 22 games over the last 10 years (hasn't played a full season in 6 years ) Springs has been in the league longer but Bly is on the feild more often. Spring base salary is $4.8M+ this year and he won't take a pay cut (he's willing to restructure to get that $4M upfront but he wants it all) Bly is due $4.2M this year he wants a long term deal (meaning he wants his $4M upfront too). Dre just looks like the better deal here when you throw in the number of additional picks the Skins could get and take into account that a long term deal for Bly would make this year's cap number lower than the $4.2 that he is currently due and Springs as it stands now has a cap hit over $7.5M.

[1niksder]

OK, I don't get it - that just seems to confirm what I was saying. Bly doesn't want to come here because he loves this team - he wants to come here because we've offered the most money. If Denver offered to match our terms (but they won't), I imagine his response would be "Washington Who?".

Bly wanting to play close to home has a lot to do with him wanting to come to Washington.

Yes, obviously restructured contracts get done every year, but isn't the team actually talking about a salary cut, not just a restructure? And Springs has already responded - by saying no. Clearly, the next move seems to belong to the team - pay him, deal him, or cut him.

That's why they are trying to get a replacement in Bly, Springs knew this was coming ( who gets a raise in their base salary from $750000 to $4.8 million in one year?) How many that do get to keep it when they didn't show up for work half of the time?

[Fios]

Bly was told he was going to get a new contract, to the point that he was in negotiations for it and then the Lions screwed him, which is their prerogative. The Bronos have made it clear they aren't going to pay him and so Bly is, justifiably, upset. He has had enough class to not say anything himself, which I respect. He is from Virginia so playing here has an extra incentive.
The fact that Springs said no makes this his problem, NO ONE is going to pay him at his current salary so it's asinine for him to posture as if someone will.

[Mursilis]

OK, I don't get it - that just seems to confirm what I was saying. Bly doesn't want to come here because he loves this team - he wants to come here because we've offered the most money. If Denver offered to match our terms (but they won't), I imagine his response would be "Washington Who?".

Bly wanting to play close to home has a lot to do with him wanting to come to Washington.

Yes, obviously restructured contracts get done every year, but isn't the team actually talking about a salary cut, not just a restructure? And Springs has already responded - by saying no. Clearly, the next move seems to belong to the team - pay him, deal him, or cut him.

That's why they are trying to get a replacement in Bly, Springs knew this was coming ( who gets a raise in their base salary from $750000 to $4.8 million in one year?) How many that do get to keep it when they didn't show up for work half of the time?

I'm not saying I agree with the way Springs has handled this, but with the crazy money being thrown around for free agents, I can't blame the guy for trying to maximize his paycheck.

[skinsfan#33]

OK, I don't get it - that just seems to confirm what I was saying. Bly doesn't want to come here because he loves this team - he wants to come here because we've offered the most money. If Denver offered to match our terms (but they won't), I imagine his response would be "Washington Who?".

Bly wanting to play close to home has a lot to do with him wanting to come to Washington.

Yes, obviously restructured contracts get done every year, but isn't the team actually talking about a salary cut, not just a restructure? And Springs has already responded - by saying no. Clearly, the next move seems to belong to the team - pay him, deal him, or cut him.

That's why they are trying to get a replacement in Bly, Springs knew this was coming ( who gets a raise in their base salary from $750000 to $4.8 million in one year?) How many that do get to keep it when they didn't show up for work half of the time?

I'm not saying I agree with the way Springs has handled this, but with the crazy money being thrown around for free agents, I can't blame the guy for trying to maximize his paycheck.

Springs is trying to force a trade (or release) so he can make more money. Restructuring almost never puts less money in a players pocket.

There is no conceivable way if we trade for Bly to lower the cap hit for our DBs, when you add in the dead cap figure that Springs would count. Heck it doesn't even save the team any money to cut him before 1 June. So unless they get a trade, worthy of a starting CB, they should just keep him!

[1niksder]

There is no conceivable way if we trade for Bly to lower the cap hit for our DBs, when you add in the dead cap figure that Springs would count. Heck it doesn't even save the team any money to cut him before 1 June. So unless they get a trade, worthy of a starting CB, they should just keep him!

Actually I'd rather have a starting CB and some draft pick for Springs even if it takes more than one trade to get it done.

A couple of draft picks from Detroit wouldn't be bad IF we could get Bly and a bunch of picks from Denver.

Springs Cap number will only go up $93,000 if he were traded today and the hit would be $7.451 million versus the current hit of $7.358 million. those are the options that he is giving the Skins. So come June 1st they let him go and the Base salary come off this years cap making his deadcap # $2.48 million or a saving of $4.8 million (you can call it a savings but it would start the 2008 cap number at almost $5 million ).
Bly would come in with a base of $4.2 million (which would be the starting point of talks because the Skins need that number to come down), Bly would go for it because it cash in his pocket add a little to it to make the next few years cap friendly then pro-rate all of it over 5 years and you have a pretty good size savings in cap space (not just this year but for the next few.. considering Springs cap number is bigger in 2008 than this year if the contract doesn't change). If he want out before June he'll have to pull a Lavar (I'm all for that too (if they get Bly:D )).

[tcwest10]

If this happens, I'm going to wear a bag on my head for a while.

If they work this in as part of the deal, it certainly sweetens it up a little.

[SkinsJock]

If this happens, I'm going to wear a bag on my head for a while.

If they work this in as part of the deal, it certainly sweetens it up a little.

yeah - I had to think about this too - well, for a little while

[skinsfan#33]

There is no conceivable way if we trade for Bly to lower the cap hit for our DBs, when you add in the dead cap figure that Springs would count. Heck it doesn't even save the team any money to cut him before 1 June. So unless they get a trade, worthy of a starting CB, they should just keep him!

Actually I'd rather have a starting CB and some draft pick for Springs even if it takes more than one trade to get it done.

A couple of draft picks from Detroit wouldn't be bad IF we could get Bly and a bunch of picks from Denver.

Springs Cap number will only go up $93,000 if he were traded today and the hit would be $7.451 million versus the current hit of $7.358 million. those are the options that he is giving the Skins. So come June 1st they let him go and the Base salary come off this years cap making his deadcap # $2.48 million or a saving of $4.8 million (you can call it a savings but it would start the 2008 cap number at almost $5 million ).
Bly would come in with a base of $4.2 million (which would be the starting point of talks because the Skins need that number to come down), Bly would go for it because it cash in his pocket add a little to it to make the next few years cap friendly then pro-rate all of it over 5 years and you have a pretty good size savings in cap space (not just this year but for the next few.. considering Springs cap number is bigger in 2008 than this year if the contract doesn't change). If he want out before June he'll have to pull a Lavar (I'm all for that too (if they get Bly:D )).

If Daniel Grahm and DD both got over $15M guaranteed, then Bly will want something close to $20M. I'm thinking $20M quaranteed and maybe 50 over six years. That would put him at about $4.1-$4.2M at the lowest cap number possible for next year and he might even be reasonable the next year. He will be 30 this season and how many years can you expect from a 30 something corner.

There is no way this would be a cap friendly move.

[Fios]

If Daniel Grahm and DD both got over $15M guaranteed, then Bly will want something close to $20M. I'm thinking $20M quaranteed and maybe 50 over six years. That would put him at about $4.1-$4.2M at the lowest cap number possible for next year and he might even be reasonable the next year. He will be 30 this season and how many years can you expect from a 30 something corner.

There is no way this would be a cap friendly move.

Based on what? Because you think it can't be? You're engaging in speculation based on what you think the contract might be. If the Skins have proven anything over the past few years it is that they have mastered the art of the cap friendly deal. And I don't know anyone who knows the cap better than 1nik. He has a history of being dead-on about these issues.

[skinsfan#33]

If Daniel Grahm and DD both got over $15M guaranteed, then Bly will want something close to $20M. I'm thinking $20M quaranteed and maybe 50 over six years. That would put him at about $4.1-$4.2M at the lowest cap number possible for next year and he might even be reasonable the next year. He will be 30 this season and how many years can you expect from a 30 something corner.

There is no way this would be a cap friendly move.

Based on what? Because you think it can't be? You're engaging in speculation based on what you think the contract might be. If the Skins have proven anything over the past few years it is that they have mastered the art of the cap friendly deal. And I don't know anyone who knows the cap better than 1nik. He has a history of being dead-on about these issues.

Based on what? Well let's see I just gave you two examples that I used to make an educated guess (and that is what it is). And based on the Skins' history of over paying for average players and extremely over paying for good players that would back me up.

I can't tell if you're kidding or not about the Skins making cap friendly deals, well I can think of only 1 since Syder has been there and that is Betts. Other than that they have been the exact opposite so I must asssume you are either joking or headed for St Elizabeth's.

[Fios]

If Daniel Grahm and DD both got over $15M guaranteed, then Bly will want something close to $20M. I'm thinking $20M quaranteed and maybe 50 over six years. That would put him at about $4.1-$4.2M at the lowest cap number possible for next year and he might even be reasonable the next year. He will be 30 this season and how many years can you expect from a 30 something corner.

There is no way this would be a cap friendly move.

Based on what? Because you think it can't be? You're engaging in speculation based on what you think the contract might be. If the Skins have proven anything over the past few years it is that they have mastered the art of the cap friendly deal. And I don't know anyone who knows the cap better than 1nik. He has a history of being dead-on about these issues.

Based on what? Well let's see I just gave you two examples that I used to make an educated guess (and that is what it is). And based on the Skins' history of over paying for average players and extremely over paying for good players that would back me up.

I can't tell if you're kidding or not about the Skins making cap friendly deals, well I can think of only 1 since Syder has been there and that is Betts. Other than that they have been the exact opposite so I must asssume you are either joking or headed for St Elizabeth's.

You used some other contracts to conclude that there is "no way" this can be cap-friendly for the Redskins. If the Redskins have a history of making deals that are bad for the cap, how are they able to make any moves in the off-season? Why aren't they hamstrung by those contracts? You can only think of ONE cap friendly deal? If that were true, the Redskins would be mired in cap hell. They aren't and they haven't been for several years.

[skinsfan#33]

If Daniel Grahm and DD both got over $15M guaranteed, then Bly will want something close to $20M. I'm thinking $20M quaranteed and maybe 50 over six years. That would put him at about $4.1-$4.2M at the lowest cap number possible for next year and he might even be reasonable the next year. He will be 30 this season and how many years can you expect from a 30 something corner.

There is no way this would be a cap friendly move.

Based on what? Because you think it can't be? You're engaging in speculation based on what you think the contract might be. If the Skins have proven anything over the past few years it is that they have mastered the art of the cap friendly deal. And I don't know anyone who knows the cap better than 1nik. He has a history of being dead-on about these issues.

Based on what? Well let's see I just gave you two examples that I used to make an educated guess (and that is what it is). And based on the Skins' history of over paying for average players and extremely over paying for good players that would back me up.

I can't tell if you're kidding or not about the Skins making cap friendly deals, well I can think of only 1 since Syder has been there and that is Betts. Other than that they have been the exact opposite so I must asssume you are either joking or headed for St Elizabeth's.

You used some other contracts to conclude that there is "no way" this can be cap-friendly for the Redskins. If the Redskins have a history of making deals that are bad for the cap, how are they able to make any moves in the off-season? Why aren't they hamstrung by those contracts? You can only think of ONE cap friendly deal? If that were true, the Redskins would be mired in cap hell. They aren't and they haven't been for several years.

There is a huge difference between a cap friendly deal and the team's ability to continously push cap impact off from one year to the next. If you get a guy that doesn't want to restructure, like Springs this year and Samuals a couple of years back, it make it real hard on the team. Their "capologist" should be one of the highest paid guys at Redskins Park.

Look at the deals for AA and Lloyde. If they weren't so overpriced and very un-cap friendly to cut, AA would have been gone in a heartbeat and Llyode might be gone too! Look what kind of bind Arrington had us in. If he hadn't agreed to give back a portion of his bonus he would have been on the team last year and would have been P.O.ed. I am just flabbergasted that they are keeping AA around, even with his cap impact. But I will see how they use him this year before I am totally convinced that he is only on the team because they CAN'T afford to cut him. Now let's see if they will play him next year.

Maybe you have more faith in the front office, but I don't. They over pay players, get players that don't fit, and almost always come up on the short end of a trade, IN A MAJOR WAY!

Everymove they make I automatically assume it will be a bad move. I know that is pessimistic and I am normally an optimistic person so you can kind of see how litle faith I have in them.

[fleetus]

Bly update

Bly update: We've heard mixed things on whether or not the Redskins would trade for Dre Bly. One source close to him in Detroit said he heard there was a possibility it could still happen, but said he wouldn't be surprised if it didn't occur until the draft. Also, he said Bly was initially disappointed with the trade to Denver but is an emotional guy and often says things without much thinking.

But one Redskins source also said it was unlikely to happen.

The bottom line? Stay tuned.

[Skins2daGrave]

question, does he want to be a skin for the money or because he wants to play under Joe Gibbs or loves the tradition or hates Denver or what?

[oneman56]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2816020

looks like Bly signed with the broncos..didn't see that this has been posted yet