The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

RayNAustin wrote:Nonsense. Campbell has more experience, but Brennan is a better QB. And a case could be made for Collins being better too. He was last year undeniably (even though many still do deny it) And his stats for the pre-season are better than Campbell's.

Campbell edged out Devine....that was his pre-season accomplishment.

Preseason accomplishments are not getting cut and not getting injured.
I've never seen an NFL record book with stats from the preseason.
A case could be made for my running this message board. It would be about as strong as the case that could be made for Brennan or Collins assuming the starting QB position for the Redskins opening day this season.

BossHog wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Nonsense. Campbell has more experience, but Brennan is a better QB. And a case could be made for Collins being better too. He was last year undeniably (even though many still do deny it) And his stats for the pre-season are better than Campbell's.

Based on a couple of pre-season games against scrubs and his college career?

Thank god the coaching staff are paid to make more sound decisions than anointing a guy, who has never played a meaningful down of NFL football, as the chosen one.

I like Colt Brennan a lot...

... on the bench, holding a clipboard, and learning the intricacies of playing quarterback in the NFL.

What I don't understand is how some people seem to think that Campbell should be just given the job until the rest of the team and offense somehow gets built around him. He was clearly outplayed last year, and he failed to win many very winnable games through bad decisions or inaccurate throws. Does anyone dispute the idea that we would not have made the playoffs if he hadn't gotten injured? This preseason, he's been godawful for the last two games. At a minimum, there should have been an open competition for QB this year. Brennan is too green to start, but Collins should have been given a chance.

With our lack of a strong and deep offensive line, we need a QB who can get rid of the football fast, make quick decisions under pressure, and when the opportunities are theer, actually make completions for first downs. We don't need any more 7 yard passes on 3rd and 8. We don't have the luxury of protecting Campbell's slow windup, slow decision-making, and inaccurate downfield throws with max-protect schemes. The jury's still out on Campbell, but in the meantime, we need to start the QB who gives us the best chance on any given Sunday. Given Campbell's performance so far, I don't see how anybody can come to the conclusion that that QB is Campbell.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

roybus14 wrote:Front 1 - Another system. The radio heads and alot folks in this town question JC's smarts and ability when no other QB in this league has gone through what he has in the past 7-8 years. Manning, Favre, Hasselbeck, Brady, McNabb, Rivers, Eli, and even Cowpunk Romo all have had the benefit of playing in the same system consistently and without someone trying to change their mechanics first with Sanders and now Zorn.

JC doesn't get enough credit if you ask me.

If he wasn't a good QB he's crumble under all these constant changes. The fact that he's average in the midst of this crap says a lot about him.

It makes you wonder just how good he'd be if we'd give him a chance to succeed. Just giving him the job doesn't put him in position to succeed.

I'm a bit late on this but......excuse me? He doesn't get enough credit?

I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

May I remind you that Saunders came in 2006. Campbell became the starter in the second half of 2006. So he had 2006 and 2007 under the SAME SYSTEM. Every one of his starts have been under the same system.

This year, everyone is learning Zorn's new offense. Campbell, as the starter has received the majority of the attention, the coaching and the reps...etc, yet has performed more poorly than a dang 6th round Rookie, who by the way is also learning the new system as well as the NFL which Campbell has been a member now for 4 years.

Poor poor Jason. Jut can't get a break.
God forbid

Let me say this....if Jason Campbell had PERFORMED....he might not be in the situation requiring him to learn a new system, because had he performed as well as Collins did in the last 4 games last year, Saunders might not have been fired.

Eventually.....EVENTUALLY....we're going to stop changing systems and realize the obvious....that it's the indian and not the arrow.

RayNAustin wrote:I'm a bit late on this but......excuse me? He doesn't get enough credit?

I don't know whether to laugh or cry

When I started my career I spent 5 years in technology rotating projects, responsibilities and jobs learning to code on PCs, system coding, databases, communications, UNIX, ... I also went through a GE Technology Management Training program and got an MS in Computer science. Then I spent 2 years getting an MBA, then I spent several years in management consulting. At that point say 8-10 years into my career I had a pretty good knowledge of entire IT organizations and the businesses they enable. It takes YEARS to get all those experiences. Now it leads to a pretty good living where I pretty much do what I want.

The NFL is hyper competitive and dominated by the most elite athletes and coaches. Offenses and defenses are very complex. Quarterbacks have to master all the facets of offenses to run them and defenses to attack them. Your expectations are that people just come in from college and bam, they're ready to perform the most complex job just because they can as you put it with Colt throw a tight spiral and were good against college students then NFL scrubs? Sorry, your views are just naive. You can post this nonsense all day long and it doesn't make it true.

JC may or may not make it. The time is NOW to find out. But your contention he's already failed and we should turn to the greenest of the green is just ridiculous and we would be idiotic to follow it. Which is why the people who actually know what they are doing aren't doing it. And I'm sure there's lots of concern about JC. But undercutting his ego or turning against him before we even find out if whether all we've invested in him? This is an AFTER THE SEASON discussion. You want to kill us in the pre=season when we're already committed to a path and have NO realistic alte-natives at this point? How does that make sense?

old-timer wrote:

BossHog wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Nonsense. Campbell has more experience, but Brennan is a better QB. And a case could be made for Collins being better too. He was last year undeniably (even though many still do deny it) And his stats for the pre-season are better than Campbell's.

Based on a couple of pre-season games against scrubs and his college career?

Thank god the coaching staff are paid to make more sound decisions than anointing a guy, who has never played a meaningful down of NFL football, as the chosen one.

I like Colt Brennan a lot...

... on the bench, holding a clipboard, and learning the intricacies of playing quarterback in the NFL.

What I don't understand is how some people seem to think that Campbell should be just given the job until the rest of the team and offense somehow gets built around him. He was clearly outplayed last year, and he failed to win many very winnable games through bad decisions or inaccurate throws. Does anyone dispute the idea that we would not have made the playoffs if he hadn't gotten injured? This preseason, he's been godawful for the last two games. At a minimum, there should have been an open competition for QB this year. Brennan is too green to start, but Collins should have been given a chance.

With our lack of a strong and deep offensive line, we need a QB who can get rid of the football fast, make quick decisions under pressure, and when the opportunities are theer, actually make completions for first downs. We don't need any more 7 yard passes on 3rd and 8. We don't have the luxury of protecting Campbell's slow windup, slow decision-making, and inaccurate downfield throws with max-protect schemes. The jury's still out on Campbell, but in the meantime, we need to start the QB who gives us the best chance on any given Sunday. Given Campbell's performance so far, I don't see how anybody can come to the conclusion that that QB is Campbell.

Collins has looked horrible this pre-season, much worse than Campbell, while playing against 2nd and third stringers. It just proves that last year's success was due to his familiarity with the system. He has looked lost in the WCO. Brennan has looked pretty good against third teamers, but throws he has gotten away with against scrubs, would have been easy picks for NFL vets.

JSPB22 wrote:

old-timer wrote:

BossHog wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Nonsense. Campbell has more experience, but Brennan is a better QB. And a case could be made for Collins being better too. He was last year undeniably (even though many still do deny it) And his stats for the pre-season are better than Campbell's.

Based on a couple of pre-season games against scrubs and his college career?

Thank god the coaching staff are paid to make more sound decisions than anointing a guy, who has never played a meaningful down of NFL football, as the chosen one.

I like Colt Brennan a lot...

... on the bench, holding a clipboard, and learning the intricacies of playing quarterback in the NFL.

What I don't understand is how some people seem to think that Campbell should be just given the job until the rest of the team and offense somehow gets built around him. He was clearly outplayed last year, and he failed to win many very winnable games through bad decisions or inaccurate throws. Does anyone dispute the idea that we would not have made the playoffs if he hadn't gotten injured? This preseason, he's been godawful for the last two games. At a minimum, there should have been an open competition for QB this year. Brennan is too green to start, but Collins should have been given a chance.

With our lack of a strong and deep offensive line, we need a QB who can get rid of the football fast, make quick decisions under pressure, and when the opportunities are theer, actually make completions for first downs. We don't need any more 7 yard passes on 3rd and 8. We don't have the luxury of protecting Campbell's slow windup, slow decision-making, and inaccurate downfield throws with max-protect schemes. The jury's still out on Campbell, but in the meantime, we need to start the QB who gives us the best chance on any given Sunday. Given Campbell's performance so far, I don't see how anybody can come to the conclusion that that QB is Campbell.

Collins has looked horrible this pre-season, much worse than Campbell, while playing against 2nd and third stringers. It just proves that last year's success was due to his familiarity with the system. He has looked lost in the WCO. Brennan has looked pretty good against third teamers, but throws he has gotten away with against scrubs, would have been easy picks for NFL vets.

Well, you know what? I've seen enough of JC. 4 years is enough to show something, and he has shown nothing but a losing record and no progress. I'm willing to predict he will be no better this year, and by December we'll be 4-8 or 4-9 or similar unless we make a change.

Most QB's don't get anything like the patience he has been shown, regardless of their draft position. At this point, Jason Campbell is a bust. His problems are obvious, and there's been little progress in rectifying them. Any QB can do well with great receivers and a great offensive line, the fact that we lack both does not excuse lack of performance. If he was able to overcome a poor-to-middling supporting cast, we would have seen some flashes of it by now. I won't belabor it any further, but I think it's time to give someone else a chance.

old-timer wrote:I won't belabor it any further, but I think it's time to give someone else a chance.

Ok, who? Brennan? His confidence would be crushed by first string defenses. All pre-season he has made throws that first teamers would have intercepted. He's just plain not ready. Collins? He has looked the worst of the three in the new offense. No, we are stuck with Campbell for this season and probably the next, so you may as well get behind him and hope he does well.

what ever, you can believe that coaches don't twist things, that they won't market themselves for money, they don't play up to the fans so they can do what they want, fine. I really don't care. But speaking of players Colt has looked good, and he is the man.

VetSkinsFan wrote:

John Manfreda wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

John Manfreda wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

John Manfreda wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

John Manfreda wrote:You also forgot coulda, woulda, shoulda, he said some of those passes would have been picked off he were playing with the first string, well maybe if he was playing with the first string he wouldn't have taken that risk? Ever thought of that.

Jim Zorn disagrees with you. But what does he know about playing QB in
the NFL?

"We had a couple of fortunate catches, or I should say risky throws and very fortunate catches when you watch video again," Zorn said. "Colt Brennan had a couple of plays where they could have gone either way. … Those are things he can learn from.

"He has to become a more disciplined quarterback, not risk as much as he risks in the game. This week, it turned out great for us, a great performance. But it could easily have been the other way."

"He was very accurate in his throws," Zorn said. "I thought his decision-making was average. Even on the big play he threw to Jason Goode, that was not a great decision. But the decision he made on the corner route for a touchdown? The scramble play for a touchdown to Mason? Awesome. So it's just a mixed bag."

That's what you get with Brennan right now, and what you got from him in college (but in college, he could get away with making risky throws against the Nevadas of the world and in preseason against 3rd/4th stringers you can as well...whereas he won't be able to against first string players). Don't get me wrong, I like our project felon QB, but he's always been a risk-taker in college, and he'll be a risk-taker in the pros. He needs to sit and learn from Zorn how to play QB in the NFL. Throwing him out too early could absolutely ruin this kid, like it did to Patrick Ramsey.

Your right Zorn said that, but how do we know that he meant it? Coaches say a lot of things, they play to media all the time. They will down play there players so they won't get comfortbale. He might know a thing of two about the NFL but what he says to the media, how the hell do we know if he is really telling the truth. Gibbs always said that Ramsey was smart, tough, and had great potential. If he really thought that he would have played him. Its like he complements JC all the time, to be honest every time I see him he is yelling and hammering JC, he even starred him down in the Carolina game. You can't read into what they say all the time. Jim Zorn might have also said that because he doesn't want Colt thrown into the Wolves. He might want him to sit and learn this year, than in the future he will think of starting him. Just because he said something doesn't mean he thinks it, or even agrees with it. One more example, Jeff Bostic high school football coach said that he doesn't think he has one college player on the roster, and it turns out 13 of them went to the NFL. I know this because he said this while calling a preseason game a couple of years ago. You have to remember just because he said it doesn't mean he meant it. If Jim said that privately to somebody than u can argue it, but publicly he said it, and that doesn't mean anything.

So what you're saying is that Zorn is just throwing out BS; that he means potentially nothing that he says. All we have is what he says since we're not there at practice and the meetings. I believe that Zorn speaks hs mind. When he said the Oline was "soft," during the game, I believe he meant it. When he says he sees potential in JC, I think he means it. Where is the hair brained "doesn't mean what he says" idea based from???

Its business thats why? If he praises Colt than everyone will be calling for Colt. Two if eveyone is calling for Colt when he isn't ready, Zorn is afraid to not play Colt when he isn't ready because Zorn might loose his job. Than Zorn will get scolded for playing him when he isn't ready, but if he doesn't play him when the fans demand it, than the fans will demand he gets fired, and the fans will say if Colt is so good than why don't you play him? Its simple business, he down plays Colt so he can devolop him. He isn't Gibbs, he doesn't have credibility. He wants Colt to learn than play. If he praises Colt all the time than everyone will say start playing him, especially if JC is screwing up and our season goes through the tank. Remember this is a business if he praises Colt than he will be forced to play him, especially when Colt is the no.1 selling jersey. He is not throwing BS he is being a business man.

So..... by not saying what he means with Colt, keeping him "in his place," he keeps credibility. Yet, if he keeps blowing smoke, he can lose credibility b/c all of his pressers are nonsense.

Zorn doesn't answer to this "everyone" you refer to. Zorn answers to 1 man, and that's TheDanny. Everything else posted after "everyone" sounds like Charlie Brown's teacher. He can praise the progress or skill of a young player without immediately having to put him in. NFL coaching is not quite as black and white as it's labeled above or any arm chair GM could do it.

Yes and were does Dan make his money from? The fans, so he does have two bosses. Yes Zorn does not think he is ready, so he says that because he knows Colt is gaining popularity and if JC struggles people will demand for Colt. If Zorn doesn't play him, fans will be demanding to fire him, so what does Dan do so he can keep his clients, yes. Its Business Zorn is no idiot. Dan has clients to keep happy, and if there pissed off at their coach and stop buying stuff, than Dan will fire him to keep his clients. Its simple business, if your clients aren't happy with your workers than you fire your workers. He wants Brennan to learn this year, but he also sees he will be gaining popularity with his blog and performance, people will want to see him play maybe before he is ready, so in order to keep that from happening he will say stuff so people won't be asking for Brennan before he is ready, if we struggle. Business thats what this is.

This is football, not Microsoft. The coach's job is to field the best players available to himan utilize their talents to the best of their ability. If he does that, then TheDanny or "everyone" will stay off his back. THAT'S Zorn's job. It doesn't matter what you, me, Hog, GSPODS, or anyone thinks. Fortunately for TheDanny, there is a huge diehard fanbase that will take a lot more than this little QB controversey to discourage. Arm chair GMs like the the fans on EVERY fan forum don't matter in the decisionmaking process of the NFL.

So you think there will never be a point were fans will think they know more than the coach? If the fans want a player on the field in a strugling time and a coach doesn't, he might be fired because he is pissing off the fan base. This year if people r calling for Colt than we have a losing situation, and if he doesn't play him people will be pissed. But I really don't care this much, so fine he only answers to DAnny.

PulpExposure wrote:

John Manfreda wrote:Yes and were does Dan make his money from? The fans, so he does have two bosses. Yes Zorn does not think he is ready, so he says that because he knows Colt is gaining popularity and if JC struggles people will demand for Colt. If Zorn doesn't play him, fans will be demanding to fire him, so what does Dan do so he can keep his clients, yes. Its Business Zorn is no idiot. Dan has clients to keep happy, and if there pissed off at their coach and stop buying stuff, than Dan will fire him to keep his clients. Its simple business, if your clients aren't happy with your workers than you fire your workers. He wants Brennan to learn this year, but he also sees he will be gaining popularity with his blog and performance, people will want to see him play maybe before he is ready, so in order to keep that from happening he will say stuff so people won't be asking for Brennan before he is ready, if we struggle. Business thats what this is.

That makes no sense whatsoever. I'll respond to your ramblings with something short and to the point:

The NFL is, at it's heart, a ruthless business; you go with the guy who gives you the best chance at winning. If Jim Zorn felt that Colt Brennan gives the Redskins the best chance to win, Colt Brennan would be playing. More wins means more job security for Zorn, and more business for Snyder.

Also:

If Zorn doesn't play him, fans will be demanding to fire him, so what does Dan do so he can keep his clients, yes. Its Business Zorn is no idiot.

Seriously, was this written in English? That's about as incoherent as I've read on this board, and that says quite a bit.

If it was about solely winning Snyder wouldn't have fired Marty, winning is part of the business but there is more to it than winning. Yes winning is important but there is more. If you disagree fine I don't care just post why you disagree with me and that will be it.

Brennan is a gamer I'd bet he'd do well given a chance to start, not gonna happen but if it did I think he'd compete well.

I'm sorry John, but you are making people here see that you have very little grasp of the big picture.

we are all a little nervous about what has been happening recently and about the realities of our chances for fielding a competitive team but most of your points above about our QB situation and what you perceive are the motivations of our coach and owner are just so far fetched as to be ludicrous.

















please start taking your meds again

I think that right now anyone with any knowledge of the game can see that our QB situation is very clear - we have to hope that Campbell shows he is at least capable (and maybe better) as our "starting QB" but he is the only one of the 3 that has the ability to be our starter - he needs to step it up but he is "the guy" for right now.

I also feel that we are very lucky to have a quality back-up like Collins but, really people, Colt Brennan could be a very good QB but that is going to take some time and if everything goes well for him he might even be ready to play effectively in the NFL in a year or more. Lets support him and encourage him all we can, but, to have him on the field as our starter this year or next, means an awful lot of bad things for this team.

Brennan has looked pretty good against third teamers, but throws he has gotten away with against scrubs, would have been easy picks for NFL vets.[/quote]

If CB5 would play with the first string is stats would be even better then they are. He can't show what he has got with the third team. But if he played with the first team we would have a BIG BIG QB controversy> Its JC time. I give him 2 games to perform if not all bets are off.

Well, 12 pages in and I feel like posting...


I like Jason Campbell. I like him as our starting QB this year. He has played in several systems and done at least adequately. Collins has only done well in one, and it's not being used in DC this year.

Colt has played very well and I really like him too...to groom. I think he has that "it" that is so sought after. I just think that he needs to come up to speed with the NFL. If Jason has trouble this year, I say stick with him unless he's hurt. As next season begins though, I think an open camp is in order. Let the best man win. If Colt out performs Jason, so be it.

Champsturf wrote:Well, 12 pages in and I feel like posting...


I like Jason Campbell. I like him as our starting QB this year. He has played in several systems and done at least adequately. Collins has only done well in one, and it's not being used ini DC.

Colt has played very well and I really like him too...to groom. I think he has that "it" that is so sought after. I just think that he needs to come up to speed with the NFL. If Jason has trouble this year, I say stick with him unless he's hurt. As next season begins though, I think an open camp should be implemented. Let the best man win. If Colt out performs Jason, so be it.

Hey! Don't be trying to bring any logic or reason into this discussion.
I think quite a few members, including myself, agree with your post.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:It makes you wonder just how good he'd be if we'd give him a chance to succeed. Just giving him the job doesn't put him in position to succeed.

Agreed. It's time to find out. That anyone would advocate we not do so particularly for a career backup or a low round pick in his first season is staggering. As is the length of a thread debating that.

What's really staggering is the list of excuses for why poor Jason hasn't become Peyton Manning already.

SkinsJock wrote:I think that right now anyone with any knowledge of the game can see that our QB situation is very clear - we have to hope that Campbell shows he is at least capable (and maybe better) as our "starting QB" but he is the only one of the 3 that has the ability to be our starter - he needs to step it up but he is "the guy" for right now.

I also feel that we are very lucky to have a quality back-up like Collins but, really people, Colt Brennan could be a very good QB but that is going to take some time and if everything goes well for him he might even be ready to play effectively in the NFL in a year or more. Lets support him and encourage him all we can, but, to have him on the field as our starter this year or next, means an awful lot of bad things for this team.

Really? Anyone not agreeing with you obviously doesn't know much about the game? What arrogance.

Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game.

Even men who are considered great football men.....let's take Cowher, the hot commodity retired coach. He drafted Roethlisberger, and the plan was set in stone that Ben would sit for 2 years. Then Maddox got hurt, and then Batch, and they were forced to play Roethlisberger the rookie. They didn't choose to play him, they were forced to. And look what happened. Offensive rookie of the year. So how smart are the experts?

Same thing happened to us last year. Collins wasn't a choice, they were forced to play him. And look what happened? In retrospect, it was obvious that Collins was better suited to start (unless you aren't concerned with winning, and are totally committed to make a failing "franchise player" a success at any and all costs).

This pre-season....go look at the stats.....all of the stats for the QBs. Collins stats are better, and Brennan's are way better than Campbell. OK so they were against "scrubs". He was also playing with "scrubs"....if you'd choose to call Mason and BMC scrubs. Those scrubs led the NFL in rushing and receiving during pre-season and were cut, while we kept a couple of picks that look terrible. But the experts know best.

But go ahead and compare Collins stats to Campbell, and explain to me HOW Collins looked terrible, and JC is the clear starter? The numbers don't say that. The numbers say Campbell is #3.

Collins completion % 70.2 to JC 59% 260 yards to 206. Int % better, less sacks, better yards per completion, and a QB rating of 81.9 to Campbell's 70.7.

So if Collins looked terrible, how did Campbell look? You wouldn't know, because you can't see through those rose colored glasses you wear when Campbell is on the field.

I hear some of the "experts" on TV talking about how well suited Campbell is for Zorn's WC offense. What a load of nonsense. Campbell's biggest liability is his slow decision making and slow release (been that way from day one and hasn't improved much if any). So how is that well suited for an offense that requires the QB to make quick reads of the defensive alignments at the line to set blocking assignments, and then quick reads after the snap? He has twice the responsibility he had under Saunders offense, and he struggled with that between 2006 and 2007?

I'd say you don't have to be a football expert to understand this basic logic.

This undying infatuation with Jason Campbell is bordering on mass psychosis.

Campbell looked so bad against Carolina that they had him run 3 series against Jacksonville in order to find something resembling rhythm. And after those three series they gave up, and pulled him out. I guess they figure that to continue would have been risky....not injury wise, but mentally risky.

Yet it is oh so clear that Campbell MUST BE the starter, and anyone who thinks differently just doesn't know much about football.

What a crock.


To say that it is

RayNAustin wrote:Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game

That's true. On the other hand, every year a bunch of amateur GMs and Head Coaches think that just because they think something and want immediate gratification they ASSUME they know more then the aforementioned experts, including HOF coaches and an organization who took us to the playoffs last year despite our being ravaged by injuries. Hypothetically of course.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game

That's true. On the other hand, every year a bunch of amateur GMs and Head Coaches think that just because they think something and want immediate gratification they ASSUME they know more then the aforementioned experts, including HOF coaches and an organization who took us to the playoffs last year despite our being ravaged by injuries. Hypothetically of course.

Not to mention ex-NFL QBs.

JSPB22 wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game

That's true. On the other hand, every year a bunch of amateur GMs and Head Coaches think that just because they think something and want immediate gratification they ASSUME they know more then the aforementioned experts, including HOF coaches and an organization who took us to the playoffs last year despite our being ravaged by injuries. Hypothetically of course.

Not to mention ex-NFL QBs.

The organization didn't take anyone anywhere. The players, in spite of the horrible coaching, made a run at the playoffs.

RayNAustin wrote:

JSPB22 wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game

That's true. On the other hand, every year a bunch of amateur GMs and Head Coaches think that just because they think something and want immediate gratification they ASSUME they know more then the aforementioned experts, including HOF coaches and an organization who took us to the playoffs last year despite our being ravaged by injuries. Hypothetically of course.

Not to mention ex-NFL QBs.

The organization didn't take anyone anywhere. The players, in spite of the horrible coaching, made a run at the playoffs.

All of this Colt Brennan hype is getting ridiculous. The guy played against third stringers, most of whom aren't even on NFL rosters anymore. Go check out the stats on NFL.com and take a look at how many 2nd and 3rd string qbs (that will never be more than backups) put up huge numbers during the preseason. Rookie Bret Ratliff of the Jets has a qb rating of 122.6 this preseason. Mark Brunell has a qb rating of 112.3, maybe we should bring him back

Brennan has played well, but like someone else mentioned, a lot of his passes would've been picked by first team defenders. The guy barely ever took snaps from under center at Hawaii and people honestly think that he could be an NFL starter right now? He wouldn't even last one half playing against a first string NFL defense.

JSPB22 wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:

JSPB22 wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Let me tell you something.....every single year, a large group of so called experts (those that actually work in the NFL for NFL teams) show that they don't always have a very firm grasp of the game

That's true. On the other hand, every year a bunch of amateur GMs and Head Coaches think that just because they think something and want immediate gratification they ASSUME they know more then the aforementioned experts, including HOF coaches and an organization who took us to the playoffs last year despite our being ravaged by injuries. Hypothetically of course.

Not to mention ex-NFL QBs.

The organization didn't take anyone anywhere. The players, in spite of the horrible coaching, made a run at the playoffs.

What's so funny? Are you suffering from amnesia or something?

Do you not remember what happened last year? The sideline looked like the keystone cops. They couldn't get the plays in without wasting timeouts, and they didn't know you couldn't call consecutive timeouts. They spiked the ball on first and goal from the 1 yard line with 55 seconds left to kill the clock ?? And then, they leave Portis standing on the sideline while they run Betts and Sellers. You don't leave your top RB sitting on the sideline with the game on the line. Even the network TV guys were commenting on all this stuff. It was becoming embarrassing, really. Frankly, the offense looked like it was being run by committee. A confused committee no less.

So yes, it was the players that circled the wagons, along with an unplanned injury to Campbell that set the stage for a playoff run. Not great coaching. What I remember is the futility of the "jumbo formation" that Gibbs refused to abandon every time we got into the red zone in spite of how many times it got stuffed. I remember how painfully predictable the offense was.

And most of all, I remember how we were in a free fall tail spin 4 game losing streak and working hard on a 5th until Campbell was injured and Collins came in and made the entire coaching staff look like idiots for not playing him sooner.

Brennan is easily the worst qb on the roster.but he is learning.who knows?he may be knocking on the door to be 1st string next season.