Same Position, but Different Jobs

[KazooSkinsFan]

Apparently Kazoo believes it.

Apparently 1nikster is right on your needing remedial reading because you can't read what I wrote either. At some point you may want to try to read some of my posts and learn I am actually anti-AA. I hope your bar exam is oral.

You were right about if you went to Virginia Tech you would read worse because you would have flunked out. You can't bluff your way through their heavily science curriculum like you can at liberal arts schools like Virginia.

Jealousy is a disease.

I was offered a free ride at both

So where'd you end up going?

That time VT. I wanted an education and a good job. As you noticed with your UVA English degree you had to figure out what to do for a job later.

UVA was kind enough to not hold it against me and accepted me into their MBA program a few years later. Maybe they should have because I jilted them again and went to Michigan.

Go Blue!!!!!

[The Hogster]

Apparently Kazoo believes it.

Apparently 1nikster is right on your needing remedial reading because you can't read what I wrote either. At some point you may want to try to read some of my posts and learn I am actually anti-AA. I hope your bar exam is oral.

You were right about if you went to Virginia Tech you would read worse because you would have flunked out. You can't bluff your way through their heavily science curriculum like you can at liberal arts schools like Virginia.

Jealousy is a disease.

I was offered a free ride at both

So where'd you end up going?

That time VT. I wanted an education and a good job. As you noticed with your UVA English degree you had to figure out what to do for a job later.

UVA was kind enough to not hold it against me and accepted me into their MBA program a few years later. Maybe they should have because I jilted them again and went to Michigan.

Go Blue!!!!!

If you turned down UVA for Tech I now understand why your posts make no sense. Uh...I always planned to go to law school. They don't have a pre-law program, so I majored in what interested me the most. We all can't have good luck...but if you went to Virginia Tech to end up in Business school...looks like you had no idea what you wanted to do.

[The Hogster]

1niksder, I thought you had explained things pretty well a few pages back, but your last 2 posts have really put things in perspective.

If Hogster comes back with "10 million guaranteed" I'm not sure what else there is to say.

Check and mate

Still doesn't answer the question....but hell, you guys can stroke each other and console one another from here on...the nonsenese has reached mamoth proportions.

Oh...and Archuletta's deal contains 10 million in guarantees..... 10 million will always be more than 7 million no matter how much wind u blow up our arses....have a good one. That was for you Irn-Bru.

Wow...folks will believe anything, even when it makes no sense. But such is life.

[skinsfan#33]

Had Clark and Adam both been fined 1 game check last week AA would hav lost $36,562.50 and Clark would have cough up $40,625.00 so you tell me who makes the most money. And if AA truely is the highest paid Safety in the league why is Clark making more than him on the weekly bases? (Someone mentioned Matt Bowen awhile back... he'll make more this year in base than Ryan and Adam )

you have got to be kidding. Game checks come from base sallery, not bonus. If the numbers that you gave are correct than that would mean AA earned $5,585,000 this year ($585K - game checks +$5M bonus) and Clark earned $2.3M ($650K base + $1.65M bonus). Only someone that knows very little about football would try to sell those "facts" (and they may be true) as reality. The FACT is AA makes twice as much as Clark does this year.

Only a fool would believe AA was brought in here to be a back-up, bench player, or situational player (whatever you want to call it!). If you actually believe that he was not intended on being a 3 down player, then I has some ocean front property in Arizona that I can cut you a good deal on!

[1niksder]

Had Clark and Adam both been fined 1 game check last week AA would hav lost $36,562.50 and Clark would have cough up $40,625.00 so you tell me who makes the most money. And if AA truely is the highest paid Safety in the league why is Clark making more than him on the weekly bases? (Someone mentioned Matt Bowen awhile back... he'll make more this year in base than Ryan and Adam )

you have got to be kidding. Game checks come from base sallery, not bonus. If the numbers that you gave are correct than that would mean AA earned $5,585,000 this year ($585K - game checks +$5M bonus) and Clark earned $2.3M ($650K base + $1.65M bonus). Only someone that knows very little about football would try to sell those "facts" (and they may be true) as reality. The FACT is AA makes twice as much as Clark does this year.

Only a fool would believe AA was brought in here to be a back-up, bench player, or situational player (whatever you want to call it!). If you actually believe that he was not intended on being a 3 down player, then I has some ocean front property in Arizona that I can cut you a good deal on!

Only a fool would post what someone else has already posted than cal that person a fool...

Same with the split bonus if he's cut he won't get the roster bonus next year, so he got $5M upfront blew off $5K in workout money and has a base of $585K. That's a little more that $5.5 this year if this is his only year. Clark on the other hand got $1.6M upfront and $650K this year and his base wont catch up to the bonus pay out until the last year.

[Irn-Bru]

Hogster, I can't help but notice that you spend far more time talking about how much you're blowing up other people's arguments rather than countering them.

You keep citing 10 million in guarantees, but it seems like 5 of that is caught up in the roster bonus--a bonus, yes, but not guaranteed (though the media tends to report it as such). At least, that is what 1niksder is claiming.

Your counter is that you've destroyed that argument so badly already, and why don't other people learn how to read, and you're all just consoling each other 'cause I killed you so bad in this debate, and why don't you stop making yourself look foolish. . .

As far as I'm concerned 1niksder brings some substance to the table--and like I said originaly, especially in the two posts prior to mine. I've been following this thread since the first post, but I wasn't clear on which side made sense until those last few posts made by 1niksder. . .which, again, were only countered with "man, you gotta learn to give up when you keep losing like this," and "I'm so tired of killing you at the same old arguments," and "boy, you'd better stop messing with a man," or some other form of "argumentation."

As for all of this debate as to who is going to be taking more home, all that really matters is the CAP HIT of each individual player--how much are they taking home this year and next year as it affects the cap.

The argument can be made all day that Clark only makes half of what Archuleta does but their cap hit is nearly identical for this year, and next year doesn't change drastically. 1niksder showed how Clark was going to take the free agent tour but, like Archuleta, hit an offer that he couldn't refuse very early in his trip. The Redskins lost out because Clark felt like he wouldn't be a starter here with Archuleta and the Skins didn't match the offer given by the Steelers.

I've also now seen that Archuleta's contract is deceivingly smaller than the media hoopla surrounding it, and that I don't need to listen to all these reports of it being 'the largest in history,' since he's making the same amount as Clark this year (as it stands against the cap, which is all we really need to care about).

Now, I could be wrong on this. I'm not doing the original research, I happen to trust 1niksder based on the evidence that he's bringing to the table, and I'm not seeing his arguments met with much substance other than the same one-liner, as well as a host of descriptions about how badly he's being beaten without realizing it.

So brush off this post by describing your sweet victory over my reasoning, but as far as persuasion goes 1niksder seems to have left you in the dust on this matter.

[KazooSkinsFan]

Apparently Kazoo believes it.

Apparently 1nikster is right on your needing remedial reading because you can't read what I wrote either. At some point you may want to try to read some of my posts and learn I am actually anti-AA. I hope your bar exam is oral.

You were right about if you went to Virginia Tech you would read worse because you would have flunked out. You can't bluff your way through their heavily science curriculum like you can at liberal arts schools like Virginia.

Jealousy is a disease.

I was offered a free ride at both

So where'd you end up going?

That time VT. I wanted an education and a good job. As you noticed with your UVA English degree you had to figure out what to do for a job later.

UVA was kind enough to not hold it against me and accepted me into their MBA program a few years later. Maybe they should have because I jilted them again and went to Michigan.

Go Blue!!!!!

If you turned down UVA for Tech I now understand why your posts make no sense. Uh...I always planned to go to law school. They don't have a pre-law program, so I majored in what interested me the most. We all can't have good luck...but if you went to Virginia Tech to end up in Business school...looks like you had no idea what you wanted to do.

You have no knowledge of the sciences at all, do you? You would take the snob appeal of the UVA name over a quality sciences education at VT? VT stomps UVA in almost every science but medicine. Then you are unaware how someone with a sciences background would want an MBA?

You need to expand your horizons beyond the liberal arts, dude. I do agree if I were an English major I would have picked UVA. Even though I am a sciences person I know that and you don't know the reverse, you are just interested in the snobbiest name, not the actual program. Obviously my VT degree opened all the doors I needed if you know anything about MBA programs.

[KazooSkinsFan]

Hogster, I can't help but notice that you spend far more time talking about how much you're blowing up other people's arguments rather than countering them.

You keep citing 10 million in guarantees, but it seems like 5 of that is caught up in the roster bonus--a bonus, yes, but not guaranteed (though the media tends to report it as such). At least, that is what 1niksder is claiming.

Your counter is that you've destroyed that argument so badly already, and why don't other people learn how to read, and you're all just consoling each other 'cause I killed you so bad in this debate, and why don't you stop making yourself look foolish. . .

As far as I'm concerned 1niksder brings some substance to the table--and like I said originaly, especially in the two posts prior to mine. I've been following this thread since the first post, but I wasn't clear on which side made sense until those last few posts made by 1niksder. . .which, again, were only countered with "man, you gotta learn to give up when you keep losing like this," and "I'm so tired of killing you at the same old arguments," and "boy, you'd better stop messing with a man," or some other form of "argumentation."

As for all of this debate as to who is going to be taking more home, all that really matters is the CAP HIT of each individual player--how much are they taking home this year and next year as it affects the cap.

The argument can be made all day that Clark only makes half of what Archuleta does but their cap hit is nearly identical for this year, and next year doesn't change drastically. 1niksder showed how Clark was going to take the free agent tour but, like Archuleta, hit an offer that he couldn't refuse very early in his trip. The Redskins lost out because Clark felt like he wouldn't be a starter here with Archuleta and the Skins didn't match the offer given by the Steelers.

I've also now seen that Archuleta's contract is deceivingly smaller than the media hoopla surrounding it, and that I don't need to listen to all these reports of it being 'the largest in history,' since he's making the same amount as Clark this year (as it stands against the cap, which is all we really need to care about).

Now, I could be wrong on this. I'm not doing the original research, I happen to trust 1niksder based on the evidence that he's bringing to the table, and I'm not seeing his arguments met with much substance other than the same one-liner, as well as a host of descriptions about how badly he's being beaten without realizing it.

So brush off this post by describing your sweet victory over my reasoning, but as far as persuasion goes 1niksder seems to have left you in the dust on this matter.

Well put on the actual debate. But you have to admit it's fun making Hogster mad and getting the endless angry rants and playground insults.

[The Hogster]

No, 1niksider is trying to skew the facts. A roster bonus is not guaranteed, but it is not a part of Archuletta's guarantees. He got $5 million up front, and he has option bonuses of 1 million per year, for 5 years. His total deal could be worth 30 million dollars. However, it cannot be worth less than 10 million. If he gets his roster bonus, which he will and I will explain why in a second, he will take in over 15 million.

1niksider keeps claiming that he will only keep 5 million of his bonus. He calls the flock fools because the media doesn't understand the contract, but he does. This is false. He got 5 million up front, plus his base salary...factor in his additional 1 million dollar option due at year end, and he has made over 6.5 million this year. The team has the option to release him at the end of the year, but his bonus will still be accelearated. Not likely, but possible.

In fact the roster bonus is player friendly, in that it is most likely he will get it because if we cut him prior to July of next year, the entire bonus will be accellerated and count against our salary cap. That means that we would not have Arch's services, but for Cap purposes, he will eat up 5 million in cap space....moreover, the bonus is due in only his second season....so the team basically has to just want to get rid of the guy in order to actually do it. If Washington wants to cut him that bad, doesn't it contradict his argument that we planned from the git-go to have him come off the bench in nickle or dime situations? Why would any team do that? Why would you sign a guy, that you intend to use in limited situations to a deal this large. Only to cut him 1 year in.


Secondly, I read the prior Collective Bargaining Agreement, prior to its extension last year. So I don't know all of what has changed, but the way contracts are broken down are as follows: Contracts have the following categories of compensation.

1) Signing Bonuses:
2) Option Bonuses
3) Roster Bonuses
4) Likely to Be Earned Incentives
5) Unlikely to Be Earned Incentives
6) Base Salary
7) Workout bonus:

Signing Bonus: Player gets the full amount regardless. So if we sign player A to a 10 million dollar bonus, then he gets 10 million dollars. The team can pay it all at once, or in payments. The team can also pro-rate the bonus for CAP purposes. So player A can have a 10 million dollar bonus on a 5 year contract, and the team can elect to have the bonus only count 2 million per year on the team's salary cap. Player's love the bonus because its guaranteed, lump-sum payment. Anyone would. It's also taxed only at the rate where the team plays. Salary is not...the player pays taxes in every state where the check was earned...this can make a huge difference. Archuleta already got

Option Bonus: Pretty much the same as the roster bonus. Gives the team the option of retaining the player, and the player will receive a bonus just for coming back to the team.

Roster Bonus: Most teams, other than the Skins and Seahawks use the roster bonus as a far off incentive. Meaning most teams philosophy is to load the contract on the back end with a substantial roster bonus such as 4 or 6 million in year 4 or 5, if the player is still on the roster. Javon Walker had such a deal. Deion Branch signed a deal similar to Archuleta's.

Likely to be Earned Incentive: This is when a player gets a bonus for things likely to happen such as offering a running back a bonus for rushing for a 5 TD's. This would be considered a likely to be earned incentive. Offering a running back a bonus for throwing 5 TD's would be considered unlikely to be earned. Other LBE's can be tied to team goals, like winning a certain amount of games.

Unlikely to be Earned Incentive: Unlikely to be earned incentive would be like offering Archuleta a bonus for making the Pro Bowl. He's never made the Pro Bowl, and its unlikely that he will.

Base Salary: For every credited season a player has (meaning a season where the player has met minimum requirements ) their minimum base salary increases. Salary is not guaranteed, its paid in installments, or game checks, and is taxed differently. Most players have lower salaries and larger bonuse in the contract. Base salary is no indicator of who makes more money...the bonus structure is the best indicator..another point of confusion in this debate.

Workout Bonus: Small bonus offered for working out for X number of sessions with the team or attending activities. Arch obviously blew that off.

Now Archuletta got 5 million up front with 1 million in option bonuses for 5 years. Not including his salary. So, I won't try and support my theory with speculation. 1niksider and I both agree that Arch probaly won't be here for 6 whole years. But, his argument is that we might cut him next year, and save money..therefore his deal is not that bad.

I disagree with that because as mentioned before, his bonus would be accelerated and count against the cap this year, if he's cut before June...or count the year after if he's cut after June. So I have a hard time believing the team would stick itself with 5 million in dead cap for a player thats no longer with us. Not to mention we would need to sign someone else to take his roster spot.

He also said that Arch was brought in to be a nickle/dime safety all along. He goes as far as saying that Prielou was the starter coming into the year. How does he know that? He never says. The team doesn't publish a depth chart in the offseason, and Arch ran with the first team the entire pre season. Throw in the fact that Arch is paid so much, and you get the obvious. We brought him in to start...he just hasn't performed, and thats why he got benched.

I've backed up my arguments, while yall might not like me, I make sense. Meanwhile, where's the proof that Prielou was the starter? Where's the indication that we will cut Arch? Where's the statement that we didn't bring him in to play coverage? Where's the logic of saying the guy is a run stopper but nickle or dime safety? Nickle and Dime are pass defenses...how can you effectively stop the run in a pass defense?

As for UVA, im far from a snob. In fact, I went to UVA because I'm from Virginia, and they gave me the most scholarship money. My best friend went to Tech...I never applied there....would never want to go there unless I was going to play football. You're really caught up on schools...seems like you're trying to brag...I'm not impressed...I'm sure UVA didn't miss you. I'm not gonna debate you on which school is better...US News does a good enough job with that.

Sounds like you're the one trying to brag...

[1niksder]

1niksider keeps claiming that he will only keep 5 million of his bonus. He calls the flock fools because the media doesn't understand the contract, but he does. This is false. He got 5 million up front, plus his base salary...factor in his additional 1 million dollar option due at year end, and he has made over 6.5 million this year. The team has the option to release him at the end of the year, but his bonus will still be accelearated. Not likely, but possible.

So you finally agree he only got $5M... now we are getting somewhere. However if he were scheduled to get a option bonus of $1M at the end of the year, wouldn't that have been a LTBE bonus and counted against the cap this year.

In fact the roster bonus is player friendly, in that it is most likely he will get it because if we cut him prior to July of next year, the entire bonus will be accellerated and count against our salary cap. That means that we would not have Arch's services, but for Cap purposes, he will eat up 5 million in cap space....moreover, the bonus is due in only his second season....so the team basically has to just want to get rid of the guy in order to actually do it. If Washington wants to cut him that bad, doesn't it contradict his argument that we planned from the git-go to have him come off the bench in nickle or dime situations? Why would any team do that? Why would you sign a guy, that you intend to use in limited situations to a deal this large.{/quote]
You aren'tquite getting it. If AA is cut prior to Jun 1 next year the thing the Skins have to account for is what they have paid. The roster bonus isn't due until July so they would be on the hook for the remainder of his SB and that's it

This might help you out

Now Archuletta got 5 million up front with 1 million in option bonuses for 5 years. Not including his salary. So, I won't try and support my theory with speculation. 1niksider and I both agree that Arch probaly won't be here for 6 whole years. But, his argument is that we might cut him next year, and save money..therefore his deal is not that bad.

I disagree with that because as mentioned before, his bonus would be accelerated and count against the cap this year, if he's cut before June...or count the year after if he's cut after June. So I have a hard time believing the team would stick itself with 5 million in dead cap for a player thats no longer with us. Not to mention we would need to sign someone else to take his roster spot.

The problem you are having is you are counting too many things without separating them.
1. Arch got a signing bouns of $5m the Skins cap hit is speard over the life of the deal.
2. Arch is due a $5m Roster bonus next year (not $1 m every year). The cap hit on that would be spraed out over the remainder of the contract (5 years).
3. If Arch is cut after this year he won't get the roster bonus, but the portion of his SB that was sspread out would be due. (The Skins would have to account for the $4M+ but it wouldn't be paid to AA becuase he allready has it)

He also said that Arch was brought in to be a nickle/dime safety all along. He goes as far as saying that Prielou was the starter coming into the year. How does he know that? He never says. The team doesn't publish a depth chart in the offseason, and Arch ran with the first team the entire pre season. Throw in the fact that Arch is paid so much, and you get the obvious. We brought him in to start...he just hasn't performed, and thats why he got benched.

I've backed up my arguments, while yall might not like me, I make sense. Meanwhile, where's the proof that Prielou was the starter? Where's the indication that we will cut Arch? Where's the statement that we didn't bring him in to play coverage? Where's the logic of saying the guy is a run stopper but nickle or dime safety? Nickle and Dime are pass defenses...how can you effectively stop the run in a pass defense?

You hear what you want and you run with it. My whole point was Archuleta wasn't brought in to b a cover guy and that the role was Prielou's. I said he was brought in for run support and to presser the QB as a additional DB. You may not have understood what I was saying but the rest of the board seem to have picked it up. I stood by my opinion and you disputed them with what you called facts. I proved your facts wrong. Because you had nothing left you went off on a rant that as yet to end. You've changed horses mid-stream more than once. First it was we out bidded the Bears for AA - I proved that false so you switch to say you meant Randle-El was the one you were talking about, but then I proved the Bears offered him more money up front (same deal AA got) and you left it alone.
You tried to say the Skins didn't match Pittsburgh's deal for Clark and I posted a link that showed he signed the 1st offer he got even thought he said he'd give the Skins a chance to match. You left that alone

You threw a lot out there and brought nothing to the table with you. you've proven you don't know how a player's contract works or how it's broken down. You don't have to attack peoples opinions and statements because you don't understand them, most of the time (at least around here) if you ask someone where the got that info, or came to that opinion - they'll tell you (even if they come back with I heard it at work, you can take it for what it's worth).

You stooped to stuoidity when I challenged your "facts" with FACTS...

You accused me of defending a player because the site is getting successful and that we were getting to close to the players. I pointed out my location and you left that alone.

Now you come back and want to try to discuss this like you have some sense? Sorry dude it's game day.

[The Hogster]

Yet more B.S. You're a lost cause. You try so hard to make sense its funny. An option bonus is not the same as an LBE. And Arch does have option bonuses in his contract. You're just plain wrong.

Washington Post:

Archuleta's contract, for example, includes a $5 million signing bonus with $1 million in option bonuses each year for five years, according to a source, allowing for a manageable cap number.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00558.html

You said Prielou was the starter...no one else...you. Now you're running from your own words to save face. Still no explanation for how you know Prielou was the starter when the team doesn't publish a depth chart in the offseason.

1niksider wrote:

Prioleau came into the year as the starter alongside Taylor with Springs and Rogers on the corners. AA would be like a nickle or dime S. Peirson went down and Archuleta was bumped up to a spot that he hadn't signed to play and probably got little work at in the off-season.

You said the plan was to have him play nickle or dime S...and not to be a coverage guy. Greg Williams said otherwise.

Greg Williams Said:

"We don't have any worry about him in the run front,"
assistant coach Gregg Williams said. "We don't have any worry
about him blitzing. We know he'll fit in good with that. The next
thing for him to do is to get more comfortable in our coverage
concepts."

Williams said Archuleta is having to learn new techniques,
including footwork, that weren't taught in St. Louis.

All you do is throw out speculation about cutting the guy, and loopholes for how we can avoid paying Archuleta. That is just silly. Anyway...I hope Archuleta makes a play today.

By the way, the whole board doesn't agree with you. One of your fellow staff mates is not convinced he was brought in to be a role player. Others have voiced dissenting opinions, and lets not even mention the poll. NO ONE chose Nickle or Dime safety....regardless of what "role" you want him to play, everyone believes he was brought in to start....and got benched. Everyone but you that is.

[KazooSkinsFan]

As for UVA, im far from a snob. In fact, I went to UVA because I'm from Virginia, and they gave me the most scholarship money. My best friend went to Tech...I never applied there....would never want to go there unless I was going to play football. You're really caught up on schools...seems like you're trying to brag...I'm not impressed...I'm sure UVA didn't miss you. I'm not gonna debate you on which school is better...US News does a good enough job with that.

Sounds like you're the one trying to brag...

Is that why you said "If you turned down UVA for Tech I now understand why your posts make no sense?"

As I previously told you, your "chain" has a note that says "yank me" and you're like my dog with the front doorbell, as you insist on demonstrating. I couldn't resist this one when you brought up your UVA diploma in response to 1niksder questioning your reading ability. My facts were true and i would have been glad to go to UVA had it made sense for my objectives, I was only picking on UVA to goad you. It worked.

Your posts continue endless petty insults toward anyone who dares to question you. My favorite is your howling over typos and misspellings. If you can stop ranting and insulting people your arguments will be a lot stronger. Your insults make you sound insincere and insecure, not confident.

I even tell you I"m yanking your chain and it works. But think about it, do people insulting you convince you? The double quote in "I'm" was an accidental typo, but I'm leaving it because I know how you enjoy pouncing on those.

[The Hogster]

As for UVA, im far from a snob. In fact, I went to UVA because I'm from Virginia, and they gave me the most scholarship money. My best friend went to Tech...I never applied there....would never want to go there unless I was going to play football. You're really caught up on schools...seems like you're trying to brag...I'm not impressed...I'm sure UVA didn't miss you. I'm not gonna debate you on which school is better...US News does a good enough job with that.

Sounds like you're the one trying to brag...

Is that why you said "If you turned down UVA for Tech I now understand why your posts make no sense?"

As I previously told you, your "chain" has a note that says "yank me" and you're like my dog with the front doorbell, as you insist on demonstrating. I couldn't resist this one when you brought up your UVA diploma in response to 1niksder questioning your reading ability. My facts were true and i would have been glad to go to UVA had it made sense for my objectives, I was only picking on UVA to goad you. It worked.

Your posts continue endless petty insults toward anyone who dares to question you. My favorite is your howling over typos and misspellings. If you can stop ranting and insulting people your arguments will be a lot stronger. Your insults make you sound insincere and insecure, not confident.

I even tell you I"m yanking your chain and it works. But think about it, do people insulting you convince you? The double quote in "I'm" was an accidental typo, but I'm leaving it because I know how you enjoy pouncing on those.

blah blah blah...nothing of substance just blah blah blah....games coming on....get over this.

[The Hogster]

Anyone seen Adam Archuleta??? Oh, there he is...right there behind Gibbs.

I thought signing Vincent was like finding the Holy Graile and freed up Starch to play Mutant Ninja Safety guy?

Guess not.

Where in the world is Adam Archuleta?

[KazooSkinsFan]

Anyone seen Adam Archuleta??? Oh, there he is...right there behind Gibbs.

I thought signing Vincent was like finding the Holy Graile and freed up Starch to play Mutant Ninja Safety guy?

Guess not.

Where in the world is Adam Archuleta?

Cutting wit, wow. Thinking can be dangerous when performed by an amateur.

[tcwest10]

I'm actually enjoying this thing between Niks and Tank. If you just follow along and read, you can learn something from it.
These two birds know the business. Tie up that dog, and just read...these conversations don't happen very much around here anymore.

[The Hogster]

You should know Kazoo...the Archuletta...Mutant Ninja Safety experiement was proven wrong today...he wasn't even on the field in "nickle" "dime" heck at all....Vernon Fox was in before him.....guess what...dude was wrong...it happens.

Your boy Starch-uletta is now a benchwarmer, and not the super run stuffing, pass rushing Safety-Backer-guy. Say hello to Starchie!!

[KazooSkinsFan]

You should know Kazoo

Wow, playground flashback of a playground comeback. When your only tool is a hammer of playground insults, everything looks like a nail.

[KazooSkinsFan]

the Archuletta...Mutant Ninja Safety experiement was proven wrong today...

OK, let's review your logic.

1niksder's claim: AA was originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher.

Fact: AA is no longer starting and is not playing a lot because he has pretty much sucked.

Ergo, AA was not originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher. Since he failed, that could not have been their intent when they signed him.

And you got in UVA Law School with that logic, dude?

[The Hogster]

the Archuletta...Mutant Ninja Safety experiement was proven wrong today...

OK, let's review your logic.

1niksder's claim: AA was originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher.

Fact: AA is no longer starting and is not playing a lot because he has pretty much sucked.

Ergo, AA was not originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher. Since he failed, that could not have been their intent when they signed him.

And you got in UVA Law School with that logic, dude?

Translate this from your native-tongue of nonsense. Uh, don't try and recap, your memory is worse than your skill in argument. Besides, I don't need to answer you....its all there in the thread. It's all public...anyone who cares can read for themselves...they don't need a super horrible recant of the facts in dispute.

Thanks, I'm sure your MBA serves you well in whatever you do, but conveying your opionion is obviously not a strong suit. His argument was that our intent was always to have Arch come in as a Nickle or Dime back. He proclaimed that now that Vincent is on the roster, Greg WIlliams could unleash the beast and use Arch like he planned all along.

Well, those of us with common sense disagreed, so he basically scoffed that we dont know what we're talking about. Reality has proven him wrong, and you just look like tired for running off at the mouth in a whining manner.

Here's whats obvious about your claim to have gotten a full ride to Virginia and turning it down. Get a life Kazoo, this doesn't even concern you, and you're doing such a bad job...it actually hurts his cause.

The argument sucked..."ergo" YOU LOSE..

[KazooSkinsFan]

the Archuletta...Mutant Ninja Safety experiement was proven wrong today...

OK, let's review your logic.

1niksder's claim: AA was originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher.

Fact: AA is no longer starting and is not playing a lot because he has pretty much sucked.

Ergo, AA was not originally signed to be a run stopper/pass rusher. Since he failed, that could not have been their intent when they signed him.

And you got in UVA Law School with that logic, dude?

Translate this from your native-tongue of nonsense. Uh, don't try and recap, your memory is worse than your skill in argument. Besides, I don't need to answer you....its all there in the thread. It's all public...anyone who cares can read for themselves...they don't need a super horrible recant of the facts in dispute.

Thanks, I'm sure your MBA serves you well in whatever you do, but conveying your opionion is obviously not a strong suit. His argument was that our intent was always to have Arch come in as a Nickle or Dime back. He proclaimed that now that Vincent is on the roster, Greg WIlliams could unleash the beast and use Arch like he planned all along.

Well, those of us with common sense disagreed, so he basically scoffed that we dont know what we're talking about. Reality has proven him wrong, and you just look like tired for running off at the mouth in a whining manner.

Here's whats obvious about your claim to have gotten a full ride to Virginia and turning it down. Get a life Kazoo, this doesn't even concern you, and you're doing such a bad job...it actually hurts his cause.

The argument sucked..."ergo" YOU LOSE..

Bark bark bark: Translate this from your native-tongue of nonsense.

Bark bark bark: Your memory is worse than your skill in argument

Bark bark bark: They don't need a super horrible recant of the facts in dispute

Bark bark bark: Conveying your opionion is obviously not a strong suit

Bark bark bark: Well, those of us with common sense disagreed

Bark bark bark: You just look like tired for running off at the mouth in a whining manner.

Bark bark bark: you're doing such a bad job...it actually hurts his cause.

Down Hogster, down!

You keep telling me how wrong I am, but you just can't show it. I know how 1niksder feels. I'm supposed to fold like a cheap camera to a list of teenage insults?

I really have to stop ringing that doorbell. But it's so fun. You may want to consider the words of Mark Twain. "It is better to keep ones mouth closed and be thought a fool then open it and remove all doubt."

I greatly anticipate your witty reply. Are you going to go with:

- Your momma
- Same to you

or

- Takes one to know one.

WC Fields said "I refuse to engage in an intellectual battle with an unarmed man." I'm not so nice though, sorry Hogster.

Ring

[The Hogster]

I actually read this twice looking for a point. I guess that was my fault assuming that you were capable of making one. This is typical of someone in defeat. When you have nowhere else to turn, resort to blather.

C'mon, keep 'em cmoing. Although your posts add no substance, or comedic value, there is some value in this.

Show all the children out there how horrible your life can be when you don't make good decisions. You're a good man Kazoo...you are a shining example why youngsters should work hard and stay in school.

You might wind up lonely, pathetic, and addicted to the internet. This is so sad. I think this is what John Kerry meant to say. Okay, now run along Kazoo, put that "MBA" to work.

[KazooSkinsFan]

I actually read this twice looking for a point. I guess that was my fault assuming that you were capable of making one. This is typical of someone in defeat. When you have nowhere else to turn, resort to blather.

C'mon, keep 'em cmoing. Although your posts add no substance, or comedic value, there is some value in this.

Show all the children out there how horrible your life can be when you don't make good decisions. You're a good man Kazoo...you are a shining example why youngsters should work hard and stay in school.

You might wind up lonely, pathetic, and addicted to the internet. This is so sad. I think this is what John Kerry meant to say. Okay, now run along Kazoo, put that "MBA" to work.

Ring

[1niksder]

I actually read this twice looking for a point. I guess that was my fault assuming that you were capable of making one. This is typical of someone in defeat. When you have nowhere else to turn, resort to blather.

Pot meet Kettle

[KazooSkinsFan]

I actually read this twice looking for a point. I guess that was my fault assuming that you were capable of making one. This is typical of someone in defeat. When you have nowhere else to turn, resort to blather.

Pot meet Kettle

Thank you, well put.

I tried debate with Hogster, as did 1niksder and in-bru. Problem is no matter no matter what we say all we get are the same talking points, that he's already devistated us so re-read his old talking points and insults, and a barage of new playground insults.

So, I've decided to not be productive and just keep ringing the doorbell. At least I know I'm the kettle at this point.

Ring.