chiefhog44 wrote:I’ll save my opinion for after this next move. He learned what not to do with Cerrato. Hopefully he learns what not to do from Bruce Allen. If not, there’s no hope. Because he’ll never sell this team. Well that blows.
Exactly. For a long time the problem has been that he could get away with his nonsense, because Redskins fans have been so loyal. But the situation at Fedex right now is as bad as its ever been, downright embarrassing, and it has to be affecting his bottom line $$. (Four games left in the season, not out of the playoff hunt and they are damn near giving away tix to those last two games.)
I've seen some smart posters on here say for a number of years that was the only way to get to Snyder. I doubt fans could force him to sell the team, but I do think by not showing up we can force him to change his behavior.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:The excessive amount of injuries kills me tho- the last 2 years have been nothing short of devastating in that respect. Not sure if its the strength and conditioning team, a curse, the turf, bad luck, or otherwise... But its disheartening nonetheless, and drives me away from not just the board- but the NFL in general.
I think its just one of those things. Bad luck. Strikes me as ridiculous to suggest otherwise. But you're right that its disheartening as hell, starting with Guice before the season even started!!!
If I'm not crazy, I think I read that the Skins have the most injuries in the entire league. Second year in a row. Something like 17 IR players on the offense alone and that doesn't even include Colt. How nuts is that?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
I'm enjoying seeing the long-timers post in this thread.
I share many, if not most, of the thoughts and sentiments expressed in this thread regarding the team and its management. Back in 2004 when this board was new, we all knew Snyder was not a force for good, but we hoped for growth and maturation — and everyone thought perhaps we were seeing it with the hiring of Joe Gibbs.
I held out hope as long as I possibly could, well past the point of rational thought, that maybe Dan Snyder would develop as a person and owner into someone who could do the right thing as a rule and lead the franchise to success. I'm not sure when I entirely let go of the idea, but I think it was not too long after Robert Griffin's knee gave out on the tattered pit Snyder had painted green and called a field. I've since watched this franchise, its decisions and performance, with increasing detachment.
In the meantime, it became difficult for me to ignore the problem with violence and player safety in the league. There has been progress on this front, but the way the NFL is handing it, as usual, is to pile on more rules and complexity — which leads to farcical outcomes in some cases (such as this year's 'body weight' controversy). I'm glad they are doing what they can to eliminate head-to-head hits, but I would much prefer that the league simplify rules to create new emphases instead of bolting on ad-hoc adjustments and tweaks to a fundamentally broken system. Rethink, rework, rewrite. But I digress.
Now, I could probably put up with this tension if the NFL's product on the field, and on TV, wasn't so poor and seemingly getting worse. The things I've always hated: stoppages, commercials, endless replays on loop to figure out if X happened before Y, the clock running after a player goes out of bounds, breaks between scores, flags on a quarter of the plays, watching coaches' reactions, catching drama on the sidelines and other 'side plots', games hinging on a bad penalty call . . . it never gets better, and usually gets more aggravating every year.
It's almost as if every adjustment they make to the gameday experience is designed to minimize the time spent playing the game, or at least to get that part over with as efficiently as possible, and to maximize the network's value-added entertainment and, of course, commercials. I resent that I have to 'pay' to watch by giving the network an equal or greater amount of my time and attention on the bull$#@% instead of the game. (Why can't I have a viewing experience like I get when I watch soccer and rugby?) It's all becoming too irritating to put up with, especially when I'm not fanatical about the team playing.
This is the first year I've accidentally missed entire quarters of a Skins game because I was busy with something else and forgot they were playing. I've even skipped a couple of entire games, and I don't regret it. I wouldn't have believed you in 2004 if you told me that's where I'd be in 2018.
As for this board, well, I think as a technology it fit a great niche a decade ago but has less of a place in today's Internet. And that's OK. What Mark built was amazing for its time, and for many years we had the best place on the web to talk about the Skins. I've met several board members in real life, which has been a privilege, and have become true friends with a couple of you, which is an even greater privilege. It was a home for fans before social media existed, a place to talk not just football but life. THN was special.
I wish I had more to contribute to this community, but the truth is my perspective on this team and the game itself has changed and it's just not as relevant in my life. I have very little to say about this team, except those words I still sing every time I watch them: Hail to the Redskins! Despite the pessimism I shared above, I still believe I'll hang on as a fan long enough to see better days.
What do you expect. This team has gone from a once great and proud team, to the laughing stock of the league...and it's all because of Danny Boy...if the team had stayed in the Kent Cooke family, they'd probably be still winning...
chiefhog44 wrote:I’ll save my opinion for after this next move. He learned what not to do with Cerrato. Hopefully he learns what not to do from Bruce Allen. If not, there’s no hope. Because he’ll never sell this team. Well that blows.
Exactly. For a long time the problem has been that he could get away with his nonsense, because Redskins fans have been so loyal. But the situation at Fedex right now is as bad as its ever been, downright embarrassing, and it has to be affecting his bottom line $$. (Four games left in the season, not out of the playoff hunt and they are damn near giving away tix to those last two games.)
I've seen some smart posters on here say for a number of years that was the only way to get to Snyder. I doubt fans could force him to sell the team, but I do think by not showing up we can force him to change his behavior.
we can hope - unfortunately, I don't think Snyder is as bothered by the lack of interest + the attendance drop as much as some might think & hope - I do think that it bothers the NFL a great deal and they might take action
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
luck has nothing to do with who wins or loses - some franchises are structured to handle the injuries and the setbacks that are a part of the NFL better than others - while we hope to be lucky enough to win each game, most NFL franchise ensure that luck will have nothing to do with the outcome
we don't need no stinking excuses - we are who we are and the next man up needs to play his tail off this Sunday
HTTR
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
SkinsJock wrote:luck has nothing to do with who wins or loses - some franchises are structured to handle the injuries and the setbacks that are a part of the NFL better than others - while we hope to be lucky enough to win each game, most NFL franchise ensure that luck will have nothing to do with the outcome
we don't need no stinking excuses - we are who we are and the next man up needs to play his tail off this Sunday
HTTR
I call bull *sh$t*. If NE lost Brady AND the back up theyd be torched. If the saints lost Breezy and Thomas they'd be done. If the rams lost Goff and Gurley theyd be screwed.
Weve lost our starting Rb (pre-season) starting qb AND BACK UP, starting wideout, and both starting guards... Other injuries we have been able to cope with like the best LT in the biz, Crowder, and Thompson.. Adding AP late in the offseason- Dunny to an extent... Injuries DO happen, but this isnt any where near the first preseason game starters- by nearly half the players!
Bro- every team only gets 53 players- and as Riggo pointed out we've suffered from injuries greater then any team 2 years running- at KEY positions.
Pass the pipe
#21 forever in our hearts “I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:I call bull *sh$t*. If NE lost Brady AND the back up theyd be torched. If the saints lost Breezy and Thomas they'd be done. If the rams lost Goff and Gurley theyd be screwed.
You're completely right. Players matter. This stuff that "fans" throw out there is detached from reality. Check out the Packers record minus Rodgers. Andrew Luck gets injured, the Colts lose and the coach gets fired. That's reality. The teams with the best players win.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:I call bull *sh$t*. If NE lost Brady AND the back up theyd be torched. If the saints lost Breezy and Thomas they'd be done. If the rams lost Goff and Gurley theyd be screwed.
You're completely right. Players matter. This stuff that "fans" throw out there is detached from reality. Check out the Packers record minus Rodgers. Andrew Luck gets injured, the Colts lose and the coach gets fired. That's reality. The teams with the best players win.
Yes, but the difference is those teams have impact players at those positions. The difference between what Alex Smith was doing and what Colt McCoy would have been doing this season is marginal. It's only because the next guy up was and is one of the worst quarterbacks to ever play in the NFL that we noticed the drop-off. We haven't had a QB as good as Brady, Brees, or Luck since Mark Rypien. We haven't had an impact wide receiver that we drafted since Art Monk? Or an impact running back that we drafted since Timmy Smith? Our drafting has sucked for the past twenty-five plus years, even longer than Snyder has owned the team. Kirk Cousins wasn't great and isn't great but he's the first player we've drafted in decades that hasn't been "just another guy" on offense. I think that's the primary difference between those other teams and the Redskins.
“He was at that time the smartest player in the league. We did everything we could to try to eliminate him from the play. We knew if we didn’t neutralize him, then we had less of a chance of winning.” - John Hannah on Chris Hanburger
Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:Yes, but the difference is those teams have impact players at those positions. The difference between what Alex Smith was doing and what Colt McCoy would have been doing this season is marginal. It's only because the next guy up was and is one of the worst quarterbacks to ever play in the NFL that we noticed the drop-off. We haven't had a QB as good as Brady, Brees, or Luck since Mark Rypien. We haven't had an impact wide receiver that we drafted since Art Monk? Or an impact running back that we drafted since Timmy Smith? Our drafting has sucked for the past twenty-five plus years, even longer than Snyder has owned the team. Kirk Cousins wasn't great and isn't great but he's the first player we've drafted in decades that hasn't been "just another guy" on offense. I think that's the primary difference between those other teams and the Redskins.
Not addressing the QB position you mean? Completely agree. That probably has something a little something to do with our never having an "impact" WR too.
Not to get crazy off topic, but I disagree that we've never drafted an impact running back. Stephen Davis was a 4th round pick by the team in 1996. That dude was a monster. Three straight 1400+ yard seasons for the team and one more for the Panthers on the way to the super bowl that year.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "You can't do epic **** with basic people." - DJax "We're on the rise, man, whether you're on the train or not." - Josh Norman
I rest my case - teams with people in charge that know what they're doing, manage to get through the setbacks that all NFL franchises go through
it's very unfortunate that we've had an unbelievable number of injuries the past 2 seasons but we've had 19 years of having bad management here and the record of under 8 wins per season over that span is not mainly due to injuries
actually to be factual - it hasn't been due to bad management it's been more due to no management
having Vinny Cerrato and Bruce Allen advising Dan Snyder is not a recipe that too many franchises will follow
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:Yes, but the difference is those teams have impact players at those positions. The difference between what Alex Smith was doing and what Colt McCoy would have been doing this season is marginal. It's only because the next guy up was and is one of the worst quarterbacks to ever play in the NFL that we noticed the drop-off. We haven't had a QB as good as Brady, Brees, or Luck since Mark Rypien. We haven't had an impact wide receiver that we drafted since Art Monk? Or an impact running back that we drafted since Timmy Smith? Our drafting has sucked for the past twenty-five plus years, even longer than Snyder has owned the team. Kirk Cousins wasn't great and isn't great but he's the first player we've drafted in decades that hasn't been "just another guy" on offense. I think that's the primary difference between those other teams and the Redskins.
Not addressing the QB position you mean? Completely agree. That probably has something a little something to do with our never having an "impact" WR too.
Not to get crazy off topic, but I disagree that we've never drafted an impact running back. Stephen Davis was a 4th round pick by the team in 1996. That dude was a monster. Three straight 1400+ yard seasons for the team and one more for the Panthers on the way to the super bowl that year.
Yes, on the QB discussion, and I forgot Davis was drafted that recently. For some reason I had in my mind he was drafted closer to the end of the Super Bowl season. He was a beast. Agreed.
“He was at that time the smartest player in the league. We did everything we could to try to eliminate him from the play. We knew if we didn’t neutralize him, then we had less of a chance of winning.” - John Hannah on Chris Hanburger
Guice wouldve been THAT guy... I guess Alfred Morris breaking records doesnt count? Oh... And CT being one of the best players on the O doesnt count either?
ALL teams deal with injuries... BUT, its actual factual rap supernatural- we've had the MOST injuries National.
That isnt an out. Isn't an excuse.. Just real life facts
Teams lose a guard... Maybe a tackle too. We've literally lost the whole damn line and 2 qbs! 2 starting wide outs?
Now the center (thats moved around) is hurt, Mosses playing hurt all season, best LT in the game had surgery in season.. Like, wtf? Blame that on people? Its mind boggling how much adversity we've faced- and came out half eay through the season 0as top dawgs in the East! Pretty? Naw... But i see the difference from back then and now.
Just a fwiw- whats Djax and Garçon doing this weekend???????? Sucked to see em go, they had like a 1/4 tank left and wanted top dollar- similar to Kurt Grossman thinking he is Brett Favre..
The process can be gruelling, but the culture has changed- except the fan base has given up. Norman called us out... Gave away tickets... Yet still we cant back our squad win or lose???
Born in 85 here... Learn-ed of the HOGs and the glory days from Gibbs. But have been faithful through poop pile after poop pile- and its getting better despite the recent decline.
HC? GM? Nah... If we want to win the division NOW, I'd offer a 5th for RG3. Fa kit
#21 forever in our hearts “I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley
we don't need to do anything stupid anymore - that's why we're in the mess we're in
the thing is we don't have anyone that knows how to rebuild this roster
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
Still talks of signing kaperdick (a total disgrace to this Nation), overpaid crybabies kneeling during the National Anthem and disrespecting our flag, and a liberal commissioner that has no balls to stand up for what is constitutionally right in this country! I am done with this team and I am done with the *f$ck* NFL! All you people that disagree can have this stupid BS! I have been a fan for 45 years and now I am DONE! BYE BYE NFL LOSERS!
heatman28 wrote:Still talks of signing kaperdick (a total disgrace to this Nation), overpaid crybabies kneeling during the National Anthem and disrespecting our flag, and a liberal commissioner that has no balls to stand up for what is constitutionally right in this country! I am done with this team and I am done with the *f$ck* NFL! All you people that disagree can have this stupid BS! I have been a fan for 45 years and now I am DONE! BYE BYE NFL LOSERS!
“He was at that time the smartest player in the league. We did everything we could to try to eliminate him from the play. We knew if we didn’t neutralize him, then we had less of a chance of winning.” - John Hannah on Chris Hanburger
I've been here a long time in the background and have since vanished, popping in on rare occasion to see what's going on, so I'll throw in my $0.02
I pretty much threw in the towel when NFL players really started using the game as their political soap box. I watched football on the weekends as a break from work and the constant bombardment of news, politics, social media, etc. When I had to start watching the players and owners using the NFL to demonstrate and dragging all that crap into what was supposed to be pure entertainment I started doing other things with my time. Being very pro-police with family and friends in law enforcement, it really grated on me when my 'Skins ran out of the tunnel with that "hands-up" BS. It was pretty much down hill from there.
As for the team/owner/whatever, I enjoyed the ups and downs. RG3 didn't pan out, but showed flashes of what the team could be with a superstar. I still feel that if Shanny & Son had taken better care of him and Robert took better care of himself, the sky was the limit. I thought the team was finally starting to find some stability and identity between both the Shanahan and Gruden hires. It looked like the ups and downs were beginning to trend upward. Oh well.
As for the board: used vinyl is making a real comeback so I don't need to log in to hear broken records. The previous comment about the endless Snyder and Front Office bashing being a downer is accurate. It's a guaranteed thread-killer.
You guys are great and I miss loving football and refreshing the long game day threads. I just can't get into it anymore.
No, SkinsJock only says what we all know. As a reminder from eight years ago, when it was easier to remember 1999, "The Cranky Redskins Fan's Guide to Dan Snyder
From A to Z (for Zorn), an encyclopedia of the owner's many failings.
We’ve been told a New Dan Snyder walks among us. The line that’s been in heavy rotation out of Redskins Park (and Snyder’s wholly-owned media empire) all season holds that he’s letting football people run the football team. His wife, Tanya Snyder, is out selling the transformation, too. Last week she went on local TV to tell an interviewer that he is now surrounded by “better people,” and that he’s “grown and he’s evolved.”
Well, maybe his wife can find evidence of Snyder’s growth and evolution. I can’t. Sure, some names have changed—Jeff George and Bruce Smith are now Donovan McNabb and Albert Haynesworth—but the ages and the bonuses have a familiar ring. So do the results: The epic humiliation of the Redskins on national television Monday night, coming mere hours after McNabb signed a mega-publicized deal with a dubious dollar value, recalls so many pages in the old Snyder’s scrapbook.
So before we welcome the New Dan Snyder, let’s look back at the one we know. That’s the Dan Snyder who left his mark, or stain, on more than just a football team. That’s the Dan Snyder who got caught forging names as a telemarketer with Snyder Communications, made a great view of the Potomac River for himself by going all Agent Orange on federally protected lands, and lost over $121 million of Bill Gates’ money while selling an “official mattress” while in charge of Six Flags. That’s the Dan Snyder I’ve found to be the most fascinating and consistent man on the planet, responsible for the hilarious and/or heinous deeds outlined in the following pages.
0-9
8-3: Record Marty Schottenheimer posted in the last 11 games of the 2001 season, his first as head coach of the Washington Redskins. Snyder fired him anyway.
$10: Amount Snyder charged fans for admission to the team’s workouts during the 2000 training camp at Redskins Park in Ashburn. He also charged another $10 to park, thereby becoming the first owner in NFL history to use team practice as a gouging mechanism.
From 'A':
A
“A Long Time”: Thirteen weeks, in Snyder-speak. During training camp in 2000, ESPN asked Snyder how long Norv Turner, who had just coached the Redskins to an NFC East title, would be in his employ. “A long time,” Snyder said. He fired Turner with three games left in the season, despite the Redskins’ winning record.
American Enterprise Institute: Conservative thinktank that summed up Snyder’s football operation as a “leading exemplar of this tendency toward irrationality” in a 2006 report. Kevin Hassett, director of economic policy studies at AEI, cited Snyder for running a “seriously mismanaged” operation. “I used the Redskins because they’re the most frightening example of a team that hadn’t thought through the simple economics of pro football,” Hassett said at the time. “The problems of running a pro football team are right out of the textbooks: With the salary cap, everybody’s got the same amount of money to spend, so let’s see what you’re going to do with your money. The big signing is counter to the economics of pro football. Over time, [Snyder is] spending the same amount of money as everybody else, but he’s spending it irrationally. I think they’re years away from correcting the mistakes they’ve made.”
Andyman: Fake name widely believed to be used by top Redskins officials to post anti-media rants on fan message boards. In 2005, Washington City Paper reported that Karl Swanson, Snyder’s longtime PR chief, had registered on sportsjournalists.com, a website where Andyman often sniped at The Washington Post. Andyman, which could be Pig Latin for Danny M (Snyder’s first name, middle initial) all but disappeared after the report.
That's just the beginning of the "hilarious and/or heinous deeds". Read on.
^^ this is hilarious - sorry welch, I was a little busy last w/e - what a nightmare it is to be a Redskins fan and want so badly for this franchise to be managed by someone other than Dan Snyder - even a hopeless GM, like some of the guys here, could do a better job than Dan Snyder
Until recently, Snyder & Allen have made a lot of really bad decisions - nobody with any sense believes this franchise will get better under their guidance Snyder's W/L record = 45% (80-96) - Snyder/Allen = 41% (59-84-1)
heatman28 wrote:Still talks of signing kaperdick (a total disgrace to this Nation), overpaid crybabies kneeling during the National Anthem and disrespecting our flag, and a liberal commissioner that has no balls to stand up for what is constitutionally right in this country! I am done with this team and I am done with the *f$ck* NFL! All you people that disagree can have this stupid BS! I have been a fan for 45 years and now I am DONE! BYE BYE NFL LOSERS!
^^^
What a bunch of crap. Let me know when you're done taking a knee for Trump.
Hog Bowl III, V, X Champion (2011, 2013, 2018)
Hognostication Champion (2011, 2013, 2016)
Hognostibowl XII Champion (2017, 2018)
Scalp 'em, Swamp 'em, We will take 'em big score! Read 'em, Weep 'em Touchdown, We want heap more!
heatman28 wrote:Still talks of signing kaperdick (a total disgrace to this Nation), overpaid crybabies kneeling during the National Anthem and disrespecting our flag, and a liberal commissioner that has no balls to stand up for what is constitutionally right in this country! I am done with this team and I am done with the *f$ck* NFL! All you people that disagree can have this stupid BS! I have been a fan for 45 years and now I am DONE! BYE BYE NFL LOSERS!
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:The excessive amount of injuries kills me tho- the last 2 years have been nothing short of devastating in that respect. Not sure if its the strength and conditioning team, a curse, the turf, bad luck, or otherwise... But its disheartening nonetheless, and drives me away from not just the board- but the NFL in general.
I think its just one of those things. Bad luck. Strikes me as ridiculous to suggest otherwise. But you're right that its disheartening as hell, starting with Guice before the season even started!!!
If I'm not crazy, I think I read that the Skins have the most injuries in the entire league. Second year in a row. Something like 17 IR players on the offense alone and that doesn't even include Colt. How nuts is that?
I think its upwards of 20, again not counting Colt... And almost to the same league high we put out last year at 23.
Bad luck is an understatement... Isht is un freakn real.
No team overcomes losing its starting rb, qb, and wr.. Not evening counting the other 17 on IR. Its crazy
#21 forever in our hearts “I wanted to just… put his lights out ….because, you know, …Dallas sucks…” - Dexter Manley
I'm tired of the losing, the bad play calls, the lack of planning for the team we are playing, the lack of halftime adjustments, a HC who's known for developing QB's not developing a QB, an offensive line that can't block, no wide receiver that can catch, Players kneeling for the Anthem, etc. etc.
How to fix this mess:
1. Fire Bruce Allen or move him away from daily football operations.
2. Fire Jay Gruden.
3. Go find Scot McCloughan and grovel. Promise to double his salary. Sign an agreement Mr. Snyder will allow Scot to do his job with out meddling.
4. Do whatever it takes to get Nick Saban. If he won't budge then IDK... hire a proven HC at whatever the cost. Has anyone hired that ex Greenbay Packers coach yet?
5. Lastly... it's a hot topic. Ugly topic. but fans left in droves because of it.... Mr. Snyder should pass a team rule no kneeling during the Anthem. Apologize to the fans. Make punishment for the rule a game suspension with loss of pay for that game to go to the Veterans Administration or an organization that helps Widows of fallen officers.
Yes losing caused fans to leave. Losing for 15+ yrs has caused fans to dwindle. but the whole kneeling issue pissed off a lot of fans. Look at the statistics. A large % left because of it. Many of my friends have found .... "other things to do" because of it. It kinda pissed fans off that players can't wear different socks, can't wear different shoes, can't wear tape with messages on it, can't wear a t-shirt of their chosing at an after game media session but it was no punishment for kneeling. Not sure why the big issue over something that is 1% of 1% of Black dying. I guess no one cares about the 97% of Black deaths.... which is Black on Black crime.
Sorry if I ruffled feathers. But no matter which side your on as an owner you need to think about how to fill seats, get them purchasing food and items, and get the season ticket holders back.
I haven't been on the site for a long time because watching/supporting the Redskins was no longer enjoyable. There are a host of reasons the Redskins have failed and for me it starts with DS. Until he sells the team I don't expect any change in results. I'm not wasting my time as there are 2 many other things to do and enjoy. Good Luck to all the Redskins fans that remain.
